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Leon Goretzka

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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby Fénix » Sun May 31, 2020 9:09 am

No... He'll never be Javi Martínez or N'golo Kanté. It's impossible.

Goretzka is likely to look something like Effenberg or Bastian, it remains for him to defensively become a machine. Or perhaps some new version of Lampard and Ballack that I would really like to have because they scored plenty of goals as central midfielders/attacking midfielders coming from the second plan. When you have no finishers in 2 strikers or a striker and 2 wingers, you want to have someone from behind that arrives late and puts the back pass strongly in opponent's net.

It'll take time and we'll see what Flick has in mind and whether the German midfielder can actually explode as DM/CM and eventually become a world-class player.
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby ramsej84 » Sun May 31, 2020 9:44 am

You are right...
I added the plus sign as to show that it is not entirely javi
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby Fénix » Mon Jun 01, 2020 4:11 pm

Goretzka in just 2 months.



It's very possible and with his budget, he can pay food, supplements and apart from that treatments like Mike Tyson and Cristiano to be in top shape.

But work ethics and professionalism cannot be bought.
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby vtotheinay » Mon Jun 01, 2020 5:54 pm

Fénix wrote:Goretzka in just 2 months.



It's very possible and with his budget, he can pay food, supplements and apart from that treatments like Mike Tyson and Cristiano to be in top shape.

But work ethics and professionalism cannot be bought.


It's not 2 months. Actually at least a year minimum. First pic is from 18-19 (you can tell by the navy on the end of the arm sleeve it was last season's kit). Second pic is from last week.
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby Fénix » Mon Jun 01, 2020 7:45 pm

Still not far from February 2020. Hard work paid off and his new role is going to be very interesting.
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby aterford » Mon Jun 01, 2020 8:31 pm

Yeah, I went back and checked pics from our most recent game before lockdown...sleeves on, but it is still a crazy pronounced difference. 2019 Goretzka and March 2020 Goretzka are not terribly far apart. March 2020 Goretzka and 2019 Goretzka are a LONG way away from May 2020 Goretzka.
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby zozon » Tue Jun 02, 2020 2:44 pm

Stop fooling yourselves.
Money, proper food, weight-lifting and supplements (creatine, whey, BCAA etc) cannot make your arm (biceps/triceps/forearm) and your upper body like that in such a short time. Even a year is considered a short time for that kind of a transformation if you dont take roids.

Unless you take/inject some pharmacy-rated stuff like steroids/hormones, which is what Goretzka did.

I mean, I'm not taking anything away from his effort, he obviously spent some time with weights around and took care in the food department too, but for that transformation to happen you have to take steroids and/or hormones. It's simple.

Fénix wrote:
MUTU wrote:Steroids?

Testosterone and steroids are not necessary.
Just read what Mike Tyson did to lose 40 kg and return in top shape.


Yes, they ARE necessary. Its not like this a 2-3 year transformation.
To achieve a body look like that in such a short timespan - steroids are the only choice. if you think otherwise, you'd have to educate youself a bit more.

Also, if you really do believe that Mike Tyson took 40kg down only with supplements, green veggies and without pharmacy-chemicals, really the joke is on you.
Boxers are the epitome of using performance-enhancing drugs, from building muscle to weight-loss.
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby #12 » Tue Jun 02, 2020 9:40 pm

Well there’s still the possibility it only looks like that in that particular situation...
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby Firefox1234 » Wed Jun 10, 2020 3:12 am

Welcome to the Allianz Arena....

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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby YlonenXabi » Sun Jun 14, 2020 8:22 pm

YlonenXabi wrote:I see Goretzka as talented player that is only relying on his strengths at the moment. That's why his presence is pretty much irrelevant but still can put up a goal or two with a header or good shot

He needs someone to teach him how to play in different tactical set ups, positioning, game reading. Basically, he is a talented player that hasn't been developed due to poor coaching.


8)

The difference between a very good coach like Flick =D> and an average coach with zero tactical knowledge like Kovac [-X



YlonenXabi wrote:He is tall but he probably needs to bulk up a little bit. I really want him to become our leader in midfield as he reminds me of Ballack in a way, but when you looked at how Ballack played and acted on the field you could see he was a true leader. Goretzka is too soft for that role yet.


Maybe he reads this forum? :dante:
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby YlonenXabi » Sun Jun 14, 2020 11:04 pm

BTW his body transformation is perfectly normal for a professional football player with good genetics who puts off hard work in the gym and has some of the best fitness coaches monitoring his progress

It didn't happen overnight as you can see in this picture from September 2019 where he was already growing bigger biceps

Image


And my guess is that during the lockdown he spent more time in the gym weight lifting. And he was not training / playing games which meant less calories were burnt (weight lifting burns little calories compared to cardio)

So considering that he already had an athletic body, that he's been supervised by professional fitness coaches, that his diet is on track, that he spent more time weight lifting and that he burnt way less calories than normal I find his body transformation perfectly logic and normal


I wouldn't be suprised if he lost a little bit of muscle during the next few weeks though as a result of the weekly calories he will be burning training and playing games.
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby aterford » Mon Jun 15, 2020 12:43 am

Yep. Suspect like many athletes - even though he wasn't "buff" pre-break he was probably already really low bodyfat %. And when that's the case it's not so hard to quickly add definition/mass. Adding a bit of muscle mass on someone who is already low bodyfat will have a lot more "pop" than someone with a higher bodyfat %.
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby zozon » Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:01 am

"Adding" a bit of muscle here is a ridiculous understatement. Especially in the upper arms.

You can spend 25h a day in the gym, have the best coachs, food and supplements, but you'll never get that kind of transformation like he did in such a short time without using anabolical steroids.
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby zozon » Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:04 am

aterford wrote:Adding a bit of muscle mass on someone who is already low bodyfat will have a lot more "pop" than someone with a higher bodyfat %.


This isnt true. It seems you dont know how gym life is.
You just cant add muscle mass to Pinocchio's arms (yes, Goretzka had THAT skinny arms).
Its actually quite the opposite.

Its way easier to bulk and THEN cut the mass/fat to reveal the muscles underneath than being a skinny dude who has to add muscles AND body mass.
This is the sole reason why skinny dudes (like Goretzka is/was) have to use steroids to build up mass first, than cut that to muscles.

Example:
If Lukaku did the same transformation/used the same "things" like Goretzka did - he would look way better in terms of muscles. Because he has the better starting body mass.

https://caliberstrong.com/what-does-bulking-mean/
https://caliberstrong.com/what-does-cutting-mean/
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Re: Leon Goretzka

Postby aterford » Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:47 am

zozon wrote:
aterford wrote:Adding a bit of muscle mass on someone who is already low bodyfat will have a lot more "pop" than someone with a higher bodyfat %.


This isnt true. It seems you dont know how gym life is.
You just cant add muscle mass to Pinocchio's arms (yes, Goretzka had THAT skinny arms).
Its actually quite the opposite.

Its easier to bulk and THEN cut the fat to reveal the muscles underneath than being a skinny dude who has to add muscles AND bodymass.
This is the sole reason why skinny dudes (like Goretzka is/was) have to use steroids to build up mass first, than cut that to muscles.


Haha. Okay. Let's just say I'm pretty sure there are a dozen explanations besides "The only possible solution is steroids" that work, but I'll leave it at that. I apparently don't know how gym life is, but good thing we have a pro bodybuilder here to set us straight.
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