You are not logged in or registered. Please login or register to use the full functionality of BayernForum.com

Maltese members

A place where you can chill out with the BayernForum.com community and talk about anything.
 

Re: Maltese members

Postby Dumbledore7 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 2:04 pm

I'm not discounting these experts. Please, and I'm downright pleading here, understand that I was only giving that background because I didn't want you to simply disregard what I'm trying to explain given that.

Please also recognise that the only thing I'm trying to explain is why the halal method may not be "cruel", which is FCBayernMunchen's interpretation from what I suspect are limited facts. I simply do not care about the law, even the enforcement of practices that, due to my religious belief, I might not consider to be "right". I simply can't let people hold opinions without being informed if I can help it.

The scientific landscape for the pain stimulus is widely known as I've described above. In all likelihood, policymakers and other authorities are aware of the same facts that I presented. With a gross oversimplification from my part, I expect that they interpret the result of the data I summarised above differently such that: the high spike in stimulus means more pain, regardless how brief it is, and therefore more suffering.

People like me who attempt to justify the halal method would subjectively disagree with this. We think the longer time to surgical death is the worse way to suffer. Now given this information, which I repeat is likely the same as what the Scandinavian authorities have, I would be more interested to know how this affects your opinions. If you reckon it's still the more cruel method, that's fair enough, it's subjective. But I was not about to let people hold these opinions without these facts and you simply disregarding what I was saying simply because you wanted to posed a risk of preventing people to learn. Make of the above information what you'd like, because informing you of it was all I was trying to do.
User avatar
Dumbledore7
I'm a post king!
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 4331
Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2014 3:02 pm
Location: London
National Flag:
Indonesia
Has thanked: 3129 times
Been thanked: 2595 times
Gender: Male
BayernForum.com fan club: Active member

Re: Maltese members

Postby MUTU » Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:18 pm

Dumbledore7 wrote:I'm not discounting these experts. Please, and I'm downright pleading here, understand that I was only giving that background because I didn't want you to simply disregard what I'm trying to explain given that.

Please also recognise that the only thing I'm trying to explain is why the halal method may not be "cruel", which is FCBayernMunchen's interpretation from what I suspect are limited facts. I simply do not care about the law, even the enforcement of practices that, due to my religious belief, I might not consider to be "right". I simply can't let people hold opinions without being informed if I can help it.

The scientific landscape for the pain stimulus is widely known as I've described above. In all likelihood, policymakers and other authorities are aware of the same facts that I presented. With a gross oversimplification from my part, I expect that they interpret the result of the data I summarised above differently such that: the high spike in stimulus means more pain, regardless how brief it is, and therefore more suffering.

People like me who attempt to justify the halal method would subjectively disagree with this. We think the longer time to surgical death is the worse way to suffer. Now given this information, which I repeat is likely the same as what the Scandinavian authorities have, I would be more interested to know how this affects your opinions. If you reckon it's still the more cruel method, that's fair enough, it's subjective. But I was not about to let people hold these opinions without these facts and you simply disregarding what I was saying simply because you wanted to posed a risk of preventing people to learn. Make of the above information what you'd like, because informing you of it was all I was trying to do.

End of the day, there's no consensus. However, from what I gathered from my highly limited research on the subject, the ones with the most neutral view to the subject, that aren't driven or somewhat biased by their own religious beliefs and have the animals' best interests in mind, generally tend towards regarding Halal as more painful.
30GB free cloud storage. Click here for the referral.
User avatar
MUTU
Site Admin & EURO 2016, 2017/18 and World Cup 2018 Prediction Game Winner
Site Admin & EURO 2016, 2017/18 and World Cup 2018 Prediction Game Winner
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 39143
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:00 pm
Location: L-Imqabba, Malta
National Flag:
Malta
Has thanked: 7097 times
Been thanked: 10588 times
Gender: Male
BayernForum.com fan club: Active member
BayernForum.com donator: Yes

Re: Maltese members

Postby Dumbledore7 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:34 pm

Well, one more thing I have to impress upon is I do think (have found for a fact) that the halal method *is* more painful.

But more painful = more suffering? Not always, and certainly not in this case if you ask me.
User avatar
Dumbledore7
I'm a post king!
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 4331
Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2014 3:02 pm
Location: London
National Flag:
Indonesia
Has thanked: 3129 times
Been thanked: 2595 times
Gender: Male
BayernForum.com fan club: Active member

Re: Maltese members

Postby MUTU » Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:58 pm

Dumbledore7 wrote:Well, one more thing I have to impress upon is I do think (have found for a fact) that the halal method *is* more painful.

But more painful = more suffering? Not always, and certainly not in this case if you ask me.

I used to be under the impression that the Halal method results in a slower death.
30GB free cloud storage. Click here for the referral.
User avatar
MUTU
Site Admin & EURO 2016, 2017/18 and World Cup 2018 Prediction Game Winner
Site Admin & EURO 2016, 2017/18 and World Cup 2018 Prediction Game Winner
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 39143
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:00 pm
Location: L-Imqabba, Malta
National Flag:
Malta
Has thanked: 7097 times
Been thanked: 10588 times
Gender: Male
BayernForum.com fan club: Active member
BayernForum.com donator: Yes

Re: Maltese members

Postby Dumbledore7 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:08 pm

I thought you and most people were, and I hope I've informed enough in my long post in the previous page that it's actually quite the opposite. As long as that's understood, I'm glad regardless of what conclusion you reach after the fact.
User avatar
Dumbledore7
I'm a post king!
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 4331
Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2014 3:02 pm
Location: London
National Flag:
Indonesia
Has thanked: 3129 times
Been thanked: 2595 times
Gender: Male
BayernForum.com fan club: Active member

Re: Maltese members

Postby MUTU » Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:19 pm

Dumbledore7 wrote:I thought you and most people were, and I hope I've informed enough in my long post in the previous page that it's actually quite the opposite. As long as that's understood, I'm glad regardless of what conclusion you reach after the fact.

I've always read and heard people saying death through loss of blood is a far slower death than a bullet to the head. Your claim to the opposite came to me as quite a surprise. I've long been with the understanding that the Halal method of slaughter is both more painful and also resulting in a slower death, hence the logical conclusion of more suffering.
30GB free cloud storage. Click here for the referral.
User avatar
MUTU
Site Admin & EURO 2016, 2017/18 and World Cup 2018 Prediction Game Winner
Site Admin & EURO 2016, 2017/18 and World Cup 2018 Prediction Game Winner
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 39143
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:00 pm
Location: L-Imqabba, Malta
National Flag:
Malta
Has thanked: 7097 times
Been thanked: 10588 times
Gender: Male
BayernForum.com fan club: Active member
BayernForum.com donator: Yes

Re: Maltese members

Postby ramsej84 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:43 pm

MUTU wrote:
Dumbledore7 wrote:I thought you and most people were, and I hope I've informed enough in my long post in the previous page that it's actually quite the opposite. As long as that's understood, I'm glad regardless of what conclusion you reach after the fact.

I've always read and heard people saying death through loss of blood is a far slower death than a bullet to the head. Your claim to the opposite came to me as quite a surprise. I've long been with the understanding that the Halal method of slaughter is both more painful and also resulting in a slower death, hence the logical conclusion of more suffering.


doesn't the animal dies suffocating in it's own blood?
U l-Kotra qamet f’daqqa – u għajtet: “Jien Maltija!
Miskin min ikasbarni, - miskin min jidħak bija!”
U l-Kotra għanniet f’daqqa – u semmgħet ma’ l-irjieħ
L-Innu ta’ Malta tagħna, – u l-leħen kien rebbieħ,
User avatar
ramsej84
I tattooed BayernForum.com on my ass
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 36250
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:47 pm
Location: Birkirkara - Malta
National Flag:
Malta
Has thanked: 26588 times
Been thanked: 5366 times
Gender: Male

Re: Maltese members

Postby Dumbledore7 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:51 pm

So, you've come to the crucial point. This is starting to go beyond my expertise because it's pure physiology (I know the results but may not be able to explain why in as much detail), but the *right* way to slit the throat (any respectable guide to halal slaughtering would explain all the meticulous method of how you're supposed to do it) is supposed to have a similar, instant effect as a bullet to the head - my research seemed to have proven this through both simulation and from actual signals from nerve receptors.

It's correct that dying from the loss of blood is categorically more drawn out, however halal slaughtering, in a similar way to a bullet, should not inflict that - it's supposed to abruptly stop brain activity. The difference is of course that a bullet would physically damage the brain (this is where I switch from my science expertise to my culinary expertise ;)), which may affect the quality of the meat after death. Death by an electric shock also not only make the suffering longer but it would maintain enough brain activity to send all sorts of signals to the body which may also reduce the quality of the meat.

No, the animal doesn't die from suffocation. It dies from an instant, rather than a drawn out, deprivation of oxygen supply to the brain.
User avatar
Dumbledore7
I'm a post king!
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 4331
Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2014 3:02 pm
Location: London
National Flag:
Indonesia
Has thanked: 3129 times
Been thanked: 2595 times
Gender: Male
BayernForum.com fan club: Active member

Re: Maltese members

Postby ramsej84 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:27 pm

This is getting complex... csi like
U l-Kotra qamet f’daqqa – u għajtet: “Jien Maltija!
Miskin min ikasbarni, - miskin min jidħak bija!”
U l-Kotra għanniet f’daqqa – u semmgħet ma’ l-irjieħ
L-Innu ta’ Malta tagħna, – u l-leħen kien rebbieħ,
User avatar
ramsej84
I tattooed BayernForum.com on my ass
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 36250
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:47 pm
Location: Birkirkara - Malta
National Flag:
Malta
Has thanked: 26588 times
Been thanked: 5366 times
Gender: Male

Re: Maltese members

Postby ramsej84 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:57 pm

https://www.tvm.com.mt/mt/news/ir-reazz ... injoranza/

A Maltese professor says that it is idiotic to bash the Imam.

MEPs come out against the imam...

Apparently the Imam just started a dangerous discussion


Edit. Link in English
https://www.tvm.com.mt/en/news/is-react ... ignorance/
U l-Kotra qamet f’daqqa – u għajtet: “Jien Maltija!
Miskin min ikasbarni, - miskin min jidħak bija!”
U l-Kotra għanniet f’daqqa – u semmgħet ma’ l-irjieħ
L-Innu ta’ Malta tagħna, – u l-leħen kien rebbieħ,
User avatar
ramsej84
I tattooed BayernForum.com on my ass
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 36250
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:47 pm
Location: Birkirkara - Malta
National Flag:
Malta
Has thanked: 26588 times
Been thanked: 5366 times
Gender: Male

Re: Maltese members

Postby ramsej84 » Wed Jan 23, 2019 3:09 pm

https://www.timesofmalta.com/articles/v ... ges.700006

An orthopaedic consultant has been awarded damages of €117,173 after he was held and beaten up by three men in an incident during the Isle of MTV concert in 2013.

The case was instituted by Jason Zammit against Chris Joseph Griffiths and Anu Ogunbiyi.

He told the court that during the concert the two men and others, who remained unidentified, had been waving their hands and jumping, hitting and harassing his children in the process.

He politely asked them to stop but was ignored. Policemen who happened to be close by also told them to stop harassing them.

As the men moved on, Mr Zammit said Mr Griffiths accused him of having made a racist remark against Mr Ogunbiyi, who is of Nigerian descent.

Mr Zammit strongly denied the claim.

The group of men moved on, but they returned 45 minutes later, grabbed Mr Zammit and held him while he was punched kicked and headbutted. His daughters were also assaulted.

The accused pleaded not guilty and denied responsibility.

Testifying, Mr Griffiths said he did not know if it was Jason Zammit who had passed the racist remark, but that it came from his direction.

Magistrate Lawrence Mintoff, after hearing various witnesses, including the police, said it believed the version of events given by Mr Zammit.

The Civil Court dismissed the claim of a racist comment having been made, and added that in any case that did not justify the assault, made some 45 minutes later.

It also established that Mr Zammit had suffered a disability of 11% and ordered the accused to pay damages of €117,173 between them.
U l-Kotra qamet f’daqqa – u għajtet: “Jien Maltija!
Miskin min ikasbarni, - miskin min jidħak bija!”
U l-Kotra għanniet f’daqqa – u semmgħet ma’ l-irjieħ
L-Innu ta’ Malta tagħna, – u l-leħen kien rebbieħ,
User avatar
ramsej84
I tattooed BayernForum.com on my ass
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 36250
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:47 pm
Location: Birkirkara - Malta
National Flag:
Malta
Has thanked: 26588 times
Been thanked: 5366 times
Gender: Male

Re: Maltese members

Postby ramsej84 » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:40 am

10 PLACES TO SEE AMAZING STREET ART IN MALTA [source]
U l-Kotra qamet f’daqqa – u għajtet: “Jien Maltija!
Miskin min ikasbarni, - miskin min jidħak bija!”
U l-Kotra għanniet f’daqqa – u semmgħet ma’ l-irjieħ
L-Innu ta’ Malta tagħna, – u l-leħen kien rebbieħ,
User avatar
ramsej84
I tattooed BayernForum.com on my ass
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 36250
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:47 pm
Location: Birkirkara - Malta
National Flag:
Malta
Has thanked: 26588 times
Been thanked: 5366 times
Gender: Male

Re: Maltese members

Postby ramsej84 » Fri Jan 25, 2019 1:46 pm

https://www.timesofmalta.com/mobile/art ... ent.700186

Beware 'vain promises' of development progress, warns Church Environment Commission

Commission slams those 'interested in swelling their coffers

The “vain promises” of progress made by moguls “interested in swelling their coffers” should not be taken at face value, the Church’s Environment Commission has warned.

In a statement issued on Friday afternoon, the Commission expressed its disdain at the “monster” cranes which littered Malta’s skyline but struck a hopeful note in noting that the number of people and communities willing to oppose unsustainable development was on the rise
U l-Kotra qamet f’daqqa – u għajtet: “Jien Maltija!
Miskin min ikasbarni, - miskin min jidħak bija!”
U l-Kotra għanniet f’daqqa – u semmgħet ma’ l-irjieħ
L-Innu ta’ Malta tagħna, – u l-leħen kien rebbieħ,
User avatar
ramsej84
I tattooed BayernForum.com on my ass
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 36250
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:47 pm
Location: Birkirkara - Malta
National Flag:
Malta
Has thanked: 26588 times
Been thanked: 5366 times
Gender: Male

Re: Maltese members

Postby ramsej84 » Mon Jan 28, 2019 8:02 am

https://twitter.com/chrisfearne/status/ ... 75873?s=19

Does this tweet remind you of something similar?
U l-Kotra qamet f’daqqa – u għajtet: “Jien Maltija!
Miskin min ikasbarni, - miskin min jidħak bija!”
U l-Kotra għanniet f’daqqa – u semmgħet ma’ l-irjieħ
L-Innu ta’ Malta tagħna, – u l-leħen kien rebbieħ,
User avatar
ramsej84
I tattooed BayernForum.com on my ass
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 36250
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:47 pm
Location: Birkirkara - Malta
National Flag:
Malta
Has thanked: 26588 times
Been thanked: 5366 times
Gender: Male

Re: Maltese members

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Mon Jan 28, 2019 10:07 am

Doesn't remind me of it but thinking about it... Ribery? :lol:
Super Bayern! Super Bayern! Hey! Hey!
User avatar
FCBayernMunchen
Moderator
 
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
 
Posts: 35055
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:54 pm
Location: Malta
National Flag:
Malta
Has thanked: 10522 times
Been thanked: 8505 times
Gender: Male
BayernForum.com fan club: Active member
BayernForum.com donator: Yes

PreviousNext

Return to The Lounge

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: SemrushBot [Bot] and 2 guests