MUTU wrote:Came back here to rant about paternity leave in Malta again. I just noticed it's not 2 days as I told you, but 1 day.
It's 126 days for women, 1 for men.
Better hope for sextuplets. You get a day for each child.MUTU wrote:Came back here to rant about paternity leave in Malta again. I just noticed it's not 2 days as I told you, but 1 day.
It's 126 days for women, 1 for men.
MaCk0y wrote:Better hope for sextuplets. You get a day for each child.MUTU wrote:Came back here to rant about paternity leave in Malta again. I just noticed it's not 2 days as I told you, but 1 day.
It's 126 days for women, 1 for men.
On dier.gov.mt it says that 'The entitlement of birth leave is linked with the birth of a child and therefore in the case of a birth of twins, the entitlement is double.' I am assuming it applies to more than just twins.MUTU wrote:MaCk0y wrote:Better hope for sextuplets. You get a day for each child.MUTU wrote:Came back here to rant about paternity leave in Malta again. I just noticed it's not 2 days as I told you, but 1 day.
It's 126 days for women, 1 for men.
It doesn't work that way
MaCk0y wrote:On dier.gov.mt it says that 'The entitlement of birth leave is linked with the birth of a child and therefore in the case of a birth of twins, the entitlement is double.' I am assuming it applies to more than just twins.
MUTU wrote:Roonzil wrote:What if your dad got ill, should I pay you significantly less bc you could get the same disease? Or if I think Southern Europeans are lazy, should I pay you less, bc you might be lazy too? Should we pay left handed people less bc they can be more clumsy and thus a health risk?
Southern Europeans ARE paid less. And if I was to go to work in, say, Sweden, I wouldn't expect to earn the same salary of a Swedish male either.
MUTU wrote:Roonzil wrote:Don't know how it is in other countries, but pregnancy leave is paid by the government over here. Absolutely zero reason for anyone to pay equally skilled women any less than men.
Even if maternity leave is paid by the government in your country, maternity leave is a huge burden on any business. The business makes profit from the employees, i.e. they should bring the company more money than their salary, directly or indirectly, otherwise they would fire them. Therefore, from the company's perspective, government-paid maternity is equivalent to unpaid vacation leave of 3 months (or however long the maternity leave is in the region) which means that the company is not making the profits off the employee and the company has to deal with a long-term absence, and there's nothing much they can do about it. It's not like they can employ a replacement for 3 months, right?
MUTU wrote:Roonzil wrote:I am baffled you think I should earn less than you purely based on my gender
I never said you should earn less purely based on gender. There's skills and roles first and foremost. It's not discrimination due to gender, it's discrimination through statistics. I invite you to check the average amount of hours that males work against the average amount of hours that females work, which roughly correspond to the salary gap. This difference in amount of hours comes mainly from maternity leave (which is heavily unbalanced in favour of women, in Malta it's a ratio of 63:1) and perhaps taking care of kids when they're sick etc (because they generally put more value on family than males). The 'discrimination', therefore, is a direct result of this imbalance. If men were granted as much paternity leave, then they should and probably would get equal salaries.
MUTU wrote:If lawmakers gave equal rights to men, that is paternal leave equal to maternity leave, then salaries would be based solely on skills and performance.
Roonzil wrote:MUTU wrote:Roonzil wrote:What if your dad got ill, should I pay you significantly less bc you could get the same disease? Or if I think Southern Europeans are lazy, should I pay you less, bc you might be lazy too? Should we pay left handed people less bc they can be more clumsy and thus a health risk?
Southern Europeans ARE paid less. And if I was to go to work in, say, Sweden, I wouldn't expect to earn the same salary of a Swedish male either.
And you'd be totally fine with being paid less bc of your cultural background? Just so I don't misread your words. I'd assume you'd ask your employer to pay you the same as your Swedish colleague, bc you do the same job for the same amount of hours.
Roonzil wrote:MUTU wrote:Roonzil wrote:Don't know how it is in other countries, but pregnancy leave is paid by the government over here. Absolutely zero reason for anyone to pay equally skilled women any less than men.
Even if maternity leave is paid by the government in your country, maternity leave is a huge burden on any business. The business makes profit from the employees, i.e. they should bring the company more money than their salary, directly or indirectly, otherwise they would fire them. Therefore, from the company's perspective, government-paid maternity is equivalent to unpaid vacation leave of 3 months (or however long the maternity leave is in the region) which means that the company is not making the profits off the employee and the company has to deal with a long-term absence, and there's nothing much they can do about it. It's not like they can employ a replacement for 3 months, right?
That's exactly how it works. The government pays your employee for the weeks of maternity leave, and the business owner has that money available to hire a replacement. It's not rocket science, and happens here all the time. That's literally how maternity leave works in my country, and imo that's how it should work everywhere. Stop giving women (and business owners) the burden of a necessary evil.
Roonzil wrote:MUTU wrote:Roonzil wrote:I am baffled you think I should earn less than you purely based on my gender
I never said you should earn less purely based on gender. There's skills and roles first and foremost. It's not discrimination due to gender, it's discrimination through statistics. I invite you to check the average amount of hours that males work against the average amount of hours that females work, which roughly correspond to the salary gap. This difference in amount of hours comes mainly from maternity leave (which is heavily unbalanced in favour of women, in Malta it's a ratio of 63:1) and perhaps taking care of kids when they're sick etc (because they generally put more value on family than males). The 'discrimination', therefore, is a direct result of this imbalance. If men were granted as much paternity leave, then they should and probably would get equal salaries.
I literally said SAME HOURS, SAME WORK. Don't come at me with the 'you work less' bullshit. If you and me work the same job, work the same hours, and the same days, in the same country. Your salary should be the same as mine. I understand people get paid less if they work less. There's nothing wrong with that. No one asks for women to get paid equal for a 28 hour work week.
MUTU wrote:If you think my reasons have zero credibility, then I invite you to come up with some reasons yourself as to why the salary gap exists... because either you believe it doesn't exist (which would question why we're even arguing here), or else you think hundreds of millions of employers are biased against women or something of the sort (sounds silly, no?), or else you can come up with justifiable reasons why the gap exists (which would question why you're angry it exists).
FCBayernMunchen wrote:MUTU wrote:If lawmakers gave equal rights to men, that is paternal leave equal to maternity leave, then salaries would be based solely on skills and performance.
In many countries (and I'm not sure but I think PL might have proposed it in Malta) maternity leave can be divided among the parents however they wish. So they don't both get 3 months (for example) but they can decide how much each takes.
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aterford wrote:I'm a male social worker. Off the top of my head, I can tell you that female social workers make about $1.08 for every $1.00 a male social worker makes.
America USA wrote:Roonzil wrote:As long as I cannot hike alone, travel to certain countries alone, get equal pay for equal work, or get a certain job at all bc of my vagina, you boys need to sit the **** down!
Precisely. Feminism movement has served its purpose in the West and now it's becoming more and more about putting females on a pedestal. Meanwhile in countries like Saudi, Pakistan, Iraq, etc women have almost zero rights.
If feminists want to "travel to certain countries alone" then they need to spread their message to those parts of the World too! And good luck with that, unless you get stoned for blasphemy or some other stupid crime
And one final comment on that good ol rape analogy. Women (and Men) need to understand that there are and always will be bad people in this world looking to screw up someone's life. So as a vigilant and smart individual the best you must try to do is avoid such people. This means not going to a violent neighborhood in Detroit after sunset and driving your gf/sister/or any female you know, to her residence yourself instead of letting her all by herself in lonely streets at odd hours. That's asking for trouble and It's just plain old common sense to avoid those situations in the first place.
and one more thing, to stop frequent rapes, the smart option is not to import a large population of young men who come from regressive cultures and view women as property and somehow tend to lose control if they see a woman who's not covered from head to toe.
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