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2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby PunkCapitalist » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:26 am

Müller played wide for a big chunk of his pre-pep career. It's a matter of his FB taking offensive responsability too..

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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby JANCKER » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:42 am

Mueller was even used on the left(not as good as on the right though). Ribery-Mandzukic-Mueller... nobody remembers that? A good part of 2012-13. They were doing so great that Robben had to sit on the bench.
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Firefox1234 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 8:59 pm

I wanted to continue the conversation in this thread about switching to a 442 base instead of a 433. Am I the only one who think Bayern are a 442 base team now? Are people here surprised as I am that Ancelotti still has us playing in a 433?

Even under Pep who is famed for his 443 I think switching to 442 from now on is the best way to get the best out our players especially Thomas Muller who is not much of a winger anymore. @Jorge Mentioned 4132 as an option and I think it's spot on. I hope Carlo sees this sooner or later cause I don't think any amount of adjustment will get this team working in 433 this season especially if we want Muller to regain his form.
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:18 pm

I'll be the controversial poster with the lineup that'll never happen:



The graphic is a bit misleading. Muller would be closer to Lewandowski and Ribery, effectively a 3-4-3, but his set position would be slightly more to the centre. A kind of winger/SS hybrid.
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:27 pm

Firefox1234 wrote:I wanted to continue the conversation in this thread about switching to a 442 base instead of a 433. Am I the only one who think Bayern are a 442 base team now? Are people here surprised as I am that Ancelotti still has us playing in a 433?

Even under Pep who is famed for his 443 I think switching to 442 from now on is the best way to get the best out our players especially Thomas Muller who is not much of a winger anymore. @Jorge Mentioned 4132 as an option and I think it's spot on. I hope Carlo sees this sooner or later cause I don't think any amount of adjustment will get this team working in 433 this season especially if we want Muller to regain his form.

The Van Gaal-ian 4-2-2 fits this squad but I feel that based on current form, the above lineup is best. Kimmich, Martinez, Thiago must not be dropped. Ribery is a necessary player at the moment. Muller is not someone I like dropping and Hummels and Boateng are good players who we shouldn't have to choose between.
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Firefox1234 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:52 pm

FCBayernMunchen wrote:
Firefox1234 wrote:I wanted to continue the conversation in this thread about switching to a 442 base instead of a 433. Am I the only one who think Bayern are a 442 base team now? Are people here surprised as I am that Ancelotti still has us playing in a 433?

Even under Pep who is famed for his 443 I think switching to 442 from now on is the best way to get the best out our players especially Thomas Muller who is not much of a winger anymore. @Jorge Mentioned 4132 as an option and I think it's spot on. I hope Carlo sees this sooner or later cause I don't think any amount of adjustment will get this team working in 433 this season especially if we want Muller to regain his form.

The Van Gaal-ian 4-2-2 fits this squad but I feel that based on current form, the above lineup is best. Kimmich, Martinez, Thiago must not be dropped. Ribery is a necessary player at the moment. Muller is not someone I like dropping and Hummels and Boateng are good players who we shouldn't have to choose between.

Thiago must stay because he adds a lot of flair and creativity in the midfield but I bet Carlo is hesitant to switch to a two man midfield since we have a lot of depth in that position...
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Firefox1234 » Fri Sep 30, 2016 8:42 am

When you mentioned the LvG 442 it reminded me how well Olivic was able to exploit the space left when man markers tried to mark Muller or Gomez and it lead to some very memorable goals in Bayern history. Right now a lot of us are wrongfully concerned with Lewa when Carlo and Pep to an extent have been abusing his ability to link up play. It has been frustrating to watch no one pulling in centrally to run in behind those channels to force a couple defenders off him. Usually Robben did a very good job of that playing wide and Muller did as an AM/SS which gave Olic a lot of space to do his damage. I hope to see something like this again:


I don't mind you're 343 since we have a lot of great CBs and a two man midfield with Thiago could compromise us. But since our formations are fluid I can see us shifting between 343 and 442 since Kimmich and Alaba are well versed at playing CB. I'm starting to think Lahm is losing his legs cause it used be him and Alaba bombing down the wings but I rarely see much of that these days so Kimmich may be the better option at RB sooner than later in my opinion but hopefully im wrong as he is the captain. But over relying on Lewa and keeping him isolated is suicide, he is great on the ball but he isn't a Messi. Defenders aren't afraid of Muller outside as he has no flair to beat a man outside and is best kept taking a load of Lewa and keeping defenders honest.
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Achilles » Fri Sep 30, 2016 9:14 am

4-2-3-1 or 4-4-2 are looking as the most promising for this squad, these are two very good formations to make Muller's abilities useful once again as SS next to Lewandowski. He can rotate easily with Thiago behind the striker with Thiago's role being as #8 or #10 having two wingers next to him and two CDM behind him either Vidal-Martinez or Vidal-Kimmich or Kimmich-Martinez, plus Sanches.

Boateng & Hummels must begin to play together and advanced Martinez as a midfielder rotating him back and forth.
It's a shame that we are not leaving for any chance the 4-3-3 if Carlo wants 4-3-3 then Muller must be dropped or play him in the middle close to the box, not RW or anything.



Renato & Kimmich duo to rotate with Martinez-Vidal and Alonso when possesion is needed or until Renato adjusts.
Thiago rotate with Muller
Costa & Coman for Robbery
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Fénix » Fri Sep 30, 2016 10:51 am

4-2-3-1, 4-4-2 and 4-4-1-1 can be the same thing depending on how do you set up the attacking tactics, duties and roles. In the defending situation this is literally the same thing since you defend with all players.

But in all three combinations Müller stays in der Raumdeuter role. Even in Guardiola's 4-1-4-1 and 3-4-2-1 ideas he was doing the same thing and producing a lot what is more than obvious if take a look at both the stats and the match performances.

Under Heynckes when he played in 4-2-3-1 a right winger is very different to Ancelotti's ideas in 4-3-3 and I don't think he is going to shine over there in this kind of role and the tactical ideas of the coach.

We simply learned to play with one more player behind the striker who often shows up as an extra player in the opponent's penalty area and that has been since van Gaal, either in 4-4-2/4-4-1-1/4-2-3-1 or in Heynckes 4-2-3-1 or Guardiola's 4-1-4-1/3-4-2-1/4-4-2/4-2-4/2-3-5.

In all these systems, the tactical ideas of all our mentioned ex-coaches contained sort of #10 role or in other words an extra center forward in the final third, predominantly Müller and sometimes Kroos who played under Heynckes.
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Coman » Sat Oct 01, 2016 3:00 pm

Image

Something I would like to see quickly.
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby mats19 » Sat Oct 01, 2016 4:32 pm

Coman wrote:Image

Something I would like to see quickly.


Wow.. quite impressive..
This would be my ideal formation too.. Very good indeed
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby ottackon » Sun Oct 09, 2016 2:49 pm

Dustin Ward from StatsBomb conducted an in-depth analysis of how the Bundesliga teams approach their build-up. Bayern Munich’s numbers separate them from the “typical Bundesliga team”, e.g. by their low percentage of passes going forward. The article breaks this phenomenon down for each Bayern player and thus gives some homework suggestions to David Alaba.

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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby ottackon » Tue Oct 11, 2016 2:29 am

Image
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Firefox1234 » Tue Oct 11, 2016 1:39 pm



I like what I see, right now Bayern are playing way too isolated especially centrally which is leaving Lewa on an island half the time. Lewa is a great link up CF but he can't be left to take on midfielders and CBs by himself....
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Re: 2016/17 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Thiagoalcantara » Sat Oct 15, 2016 6:50 pm

The team really has no identity and the football being played is terrible.

If the opponents had better quality individually, Bayern would of given up a lot more goals than what they have on paper. Honestly, I would prefer starting all 3 cbs and having Vidal/Thiago/Muller as CMs, with Robben/Costa on the wings.

Carlo went from having all brilliant individual goalscorers to a team that relied on Muller/Lewandowski to score everything.

If only this board signed Alexis or James this summer, the team would of been a lot better.
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