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2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby bastos80 » Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:32 pm

We'll most likely not have a RWB if you mean the winger position infront of a 3 man defence.
Sané ---- Lewandowski ---- Gnabry
Davies - Thiago - Kimmich - Dest
Hernández -- Alaba -- Upamecano
--------------- Neuer ----------------
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby ramsej84 » Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:39 pm

or Robben. He will own the whole flank. From one corner flag to another :lol:
U l-Kotra qamet f’daqqa – u għajtet: “Jien Maltija!
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U l-Kotra għanniet f’daqqa – u semmgħet ma’ l-irjieħ
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Tedesco » Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:46 pm

ramsej84 wrote:or Robben. He will own the whole flank. From one corner flag to another :lol:

Corner-to-corner winger? Is that a new thing?
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby bastos80 » Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:52 pm

Do you want Robben to miss 30 games a season again or something ? :lol:
Sané ---- Lewandowski ---- Gnabry
Davies - Thiago - Kimmich - Dest
Hernández -- Alaba -- Upamecano
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Rauntšik » Thu Jul 24, 2014 6:23 pm

Pep said that Lahm will play in midfield, good news for Rafinha I guess
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby PunkCapitalist » Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:01 pm

Rauntšik wrote:Pep said that Lahm will play in midfield, good news for Rafinha I guess


Which means another season of Rafinha (Rode best case scenario) plus Schweinsteiger benched for sure. Gotta love the spaniard #-o
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby pyrasur » Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:47 pm

Wonder if Lahm retired from NT because he was tired of playing RB? If so THANKS A LOT PEP. Ruins Bayern and not even coach of German NT but somehow he messed that up too :D.

There is no reason Schweinsteiger would get benched other than to keep him injury free. When Schweini is fit, Guardiola used him in every big game. Lahm is not going to be that youthful forever, and he's such a good defender AND distributor of the ball it's a waste to keep him at right back. If Guardiola plays him at right back I'm not going to complain, but there is a reason why Austria doesn't use the "best left back in the world" at LB. If Alaba could be converted from midfield to LB, the same can be done for Rode and if that comes off that's one less useless transfer in the line of Kirchoff and Petersen. The flanks are a good place for the younger players to play and develop anyway, since they are faster and develop good positional sense when they are confined by the sidelines. It's the center where we need our mature players.

My only concern is if Pep can get a good rotation of midfielders going to keep everyone in form when injury happens, and it's going to depend a lot on the formation. I don't know if this three at the back really happens, and though I am glad we are adding different aspects to our game I am skeptical of it. If we go back to our conventional back four, I just hope to see Martinez in midfield, Schweinsteiger and Lahm given proper rests, and more of the youngsters given a shot.

PS: I bet Kroos being allowed to go to Madrid has more to do with Lahm preferring midfield. This makes Lahm's coup d'etat of Ballack complete: taken the captaincy and finally gets central midfield ;)
而剑法的最高境界,则是手中无剑,心中也无剑,是以大胸怀,包容一切。那便是不杀,便是和平。-英雄
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Fénix » Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:20 pm

Firefox1234 wrote:Our Kroos replacement....
Can't see tweet? Click here!



:|
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby pyrasur » Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:26 pm

:( Sad for Kroos, or for Lahm?
而剑法的最高境界,则是手中无剑,心中也无剑,是以大胸怀,包容一切。那便是不杀,便是和平。-英雄
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Fénix » Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:43 pm

pyrasur wrote::( Sad for Kroos, or for Lahm?

No, I'm not sad at all and surely not for Kroos. :wink:

It's just.... Nah, it kills my will for living when I read this tweet.
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby JANCKER » Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:18 pm

Even Mou gave his opinion to spice it up about Lahm's position. Pep needs to be supported, this skepticism goes in favour to opponents. J. Zanetti was a fullback like Lahm, but Mou played him in midfield, Mou apparently has some kind of amnesia.
For now the board seems to be supporting him in his decisions, that's what matters.
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby PunkCapitalist » Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:23 pm

pyrasur wrote:Wonder if Lahm retired from NT because he was tired of playing RB? If so THANKS A LOT PEP. Ruins Bayern and not even coach of German NT but somehow he messed that up too :D.

There is no reason Schweinsteiger would get benched other than to keep him injury free. When Schweini is fit, Guardiola used him in every big game. Lahm is not going to be that youthful forever, and he's such a good defender AND distributor of the ball it's a waste to keep him at right back. If Guardiola plays him at right back I'm not going to complain, but there is a reason why Austria doesn't use the "best left back in the world" at LB. If Alaba could be converted from midfield to LB, the same can be done for Rode and if that comes off that's one less useless transfer in the line of Kirchoff and Petersen. The flanks are a good place for the younger players to play and develop anyway, since they are faster and develop good positional sense when they are confined by the sidelines. It's the center where we need our mature players.

My only concern is if Pep can get a good rotation of midfielders going to keep everyone in form when injury happens, and it's going to depend a lot on the formation. I don't know if this three at the back really happens, and though I am glad we are adding different aspects to our game I am skeptical of it. If we go back to our conventional back four, I just hope to see Martinez in midfield, Schweinsteiger and Lahm given proper rests, and more of the youngsters given a shot.

PS: I bet Kroos being allowed to go to Madrid has more to do with Lahm preferring midfield. This makes Lahm's coup d'etat of Ballack complete: taken the captaincy and finally gets central midfield ;)


The one good thing about Lahm in the midfield is that he can last longer in there than as a RB. But, assuming a 3-4-3, Lahm in the midfield and the unbenchable status of Thiago under Guardiola, Schweini would surely take the Bench. On the other hand, if we go with a 4-2-3-1 (with Lahm CM, Thiago CAM) then it's either Javi or Schweini benched. So no winning situation in either case. The 4-1-4-1 would be even worse, I'm sure under that formation, we would play Götze+Thiago as CAMs... All of this without even considering Alaba as a CM; if you add him, then I don't have a clue on how the spaniard intends to fit all of those players in midfield. Just Alaba + Lahm + Thiago in midfield at the same time would be dificult and mean Schweini benched, Højbjerg not getting chances, Javi not playing midfield, etc, etc, etc...

Also, Guardiola abused of rotation last season. Too much and no one gets to find their rhythm. I would hope he would rotate less this season, or at least have rotation system that means less moving between positions for the players.

But, I'm puzzled at how you say Lahm is lost as a RB. He has been consistently been more of an attacking thread in the RB, both for Bayern and Germany.
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby endrity » Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:49 am

I am sorry but I hope the club actually steps in in this case.

That is a stupid decision that we saw over and over again, for Bayern and for the German NT. Lahm is actually not that good in midfield. He's ok, it was a bit of a gimmick initially that maybe teams weren't very sure how to play against, but it's been a looooooong time since I saw a great Lahm performance in midfield. In the second half of the season and for the German NT he often struggled at both the offensive and defensive parts of the game.

And on the contrary of seeing this as as visionary act by Pep, I see it as a cowardice and lack of tactical depth. To make the story short, Pep wants Lahm to be his Xavi, because in many ways that's who he plays like. But all this tells to me is that Pep isn't even tactically flexible to be able to use a midfield pair in Schweini and Javi who have dominated games in midfield when he wasn't the coach. He's not being forced to coach mugs in midfield, but truly world class player who are slightly different to his preferences. So instead of actually fitting his tactics around the best midfield players he has in the club, he goes for a worse copy of Xavi so that he can stay true to his preferences. That really really really small time and amateurish to me.

I actually hope the club sells Rafinha to force his hand or at the very least goes and buys a truly great RB to play there.
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby endrity » Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:11 am

JANCKER wrote:Even Mou gave his opinion to spice it up about Lahm's position. Pep needs to be supported, this skepticism goes in favour to opponents. J. Zanetti was a fullback like Lahm, but Mou played him in midfield, Mou apparently has some kind of amnesia.
For now the board seems to be supporting him in his decisions, that's what matters.


There are many key differences between the Lahm and Zanetti situation. Zanetti had been switching between fullback and defensive midfielder often throughout his career. Zanetti, unlike Lahm, had more than enough physicality to play as a defensive midfielder. And most importantly, in Chivu and Maicon Inter had two very good fullbacks and not enough great midfielders.

We instead have Rafina! And it needs to be said over and over again because people rationalise this too much: Rafinha is UTTERLY INCOMPETENT to play at the highest level and I am not exagerating. He's a worse version of Marcelo, the player Germany picked on during the 7-1 drubbing of Brazil - that is a player of a lot of energy and also good technique, but that is almost always out of position. Watch him carefully and you'll see he struggles to even stay in line with the rest of the defense.
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Re: 2014/15 Tactics & Formations Thread

Postby Dgro » Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:29 am

I agree with endrity, although I am positive I don't feel as strongly as he does. Lahm isn't phenomenal in midfield, he's fine, but he's not outstanding at a club like Bayern. Meanwhile he's dynamic and incredible at RB (see: World Cup final. Just watch how active and good on the ball he is). The one possible reason I see to play him at CM this year is because he's the closest thing we have to a replacement for Kroos, but at the same time I see Bastian and Thiago as being "similar enough" (and better than Lahm in some ways) so I end up being confused again.

For a long time now I've seen people suggest, both in terms of Bayern and the National Team, that the midfield would be significantly weakened by playing Lahm at RB. I don't see it that way at all. I see the team taking a big step forward at RB and, in the case of Bayern, not losing anything in midfield if we have to replace Lahm with Javi, Thiago, Gotze, etc. Even Alaba I would rather see converted to CM than Lahm.

At this point I kinda accept it as it is what it is because Pep seems to really like Lahm at CM; I just don't get it
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