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2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby lau03143 » Sat Jul 13, 2013 9:48 am

kod2600 wrote:
tflags wrote:Seeing that just about everyone is completely clueless about what formation Guardiola shall use, makes me think the uncertainty adversary coaches and players must feel about playing against FCB.



Wouldn't that be the case at the beginning of the season only?


Yeah.

Last season, our lineup & formation was pretty much predictable. We were just unstoppable.

That's the thing. We can't continue like that as teams will learn to play against us. We need to be constantly adapting and changing the system. There's no one perfect way to play football.
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby raz25 » Sat Jul 13, 2013 10:50 am

Firefox1234 wrote:Quick question and forgive me if im the only one not on the same page but when did Schweinstiger become able to play as a lone DM? Why did Bayern pay fu€kin €40m for Javi Martinez if Schweinstiger could play as a lone DM? Was I not watching all those BvB games where Kroos was paired with Schweinstiger and BvB completely humiliated us not once, not twice, not three times but FIVE TIMES in a row in competitive fixtures!?!? Now all of a sudden people have Schweinstiger playing as the #6 in Pep's 4-1-4-1 with Martinez as a CB. Are people forgetting that it was Martinez that stepped up whenever Bayern played BvB while Schweinstiger was pretty much neutralized. But like i said someone needs to enlighten me cause i feel like I'm the crazy one......


Chill out man. Read my previous post and others' posts again, and you'll see that almost everybody agrees that Martinez would be a 'waste' in CB. But now that Thiago is almost a done deal, we try to find a way to fit everybody.

A lot of things have changed since we were getting our ass beaten by Dortmund. You are making it sound like Martinez was the only reason for our success. Dante and Mandzukic were arguably just as essential as Javi, and then Pizza and Shaq gave us the necessary depth. But most importantly, it's like we had a new coach because we had much improved tactics.

Why are you 100% sure that Schweini as the sole DM is a bad idea? Back when LvG took charge, sure he has a good history of working with youngsters, but have you guessed that Muller, Badstuber and moving Schweini to CM would be such a success? When he said and I quote 'Alaba is a LB but he doesn't know it' everybody here was laughing at him after he cost 2 goals in some match.
The point I'm trying to make, is that we have a new coach. He has different ideas, views but most importantly he has a vision. The things you think would be a bad idea, for him could be a great idea and it could turn out really nice, you have to trust him.

We also don't know for sure if Schweini will play as DM in 4-1-4-1. Or maybe he will in the beginning of the season, and maybe it won't work out. And just as I said, we can always switch back and simply not play one of Kroos/Thiago/Gotze. Pep said in the press conference that he has a plan, a vision with him and that he leaves because he wants to play, but he also said that he can play 5 different positions, which could mean that he could be the first option when somebody in the 1st 11 is not available. We'll just have to wait and see.

I doubt that this will happen, but if it doesn't work out at all with Thiago, we buy him now for 18 Mil, and in the next transfer window we can sell him for 25 Mil.
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby dambun » Sat Jul 13, 2013 12:03 pm

That's it!
We've brought Pep in, because of his vision and his tactical ideas of how the game should be approached... We have to trust him now, and give him time... He deserves that based on his resume, and we owe that to ourselves if we want to go forward as we planned...

We have to be really patient about all these matters...
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby AdepT » Sat Jul 13, 2013 2:20 pm

Can someone like pass this on to Pep? I guess it would solve all the problems. No further brainstorming required on where Thiago will fit. :)
Quoting my own post feels weird. :oops:
Spoiler: show
AdepT wrote:..............................Gotze/Mandzu...............................(False 9/9)
Ribery/Shaq.............................................Mueller/Robben
.............Schweini/Thiago............Kroos/Thiago.................
.............................Martinez/Gustavo...........................
Alaba/Contento.....Dante/Kirchoff.....Boa/DvB.....Lahm/Rafinha
...............................Neuer/Starke...............................

Front line - 6 players, 3 positions.
Midfield - 5 players, 3 positions.
Defense - 8 players, 4 positions. (Like last year)
GK - 2 players, 1 position.

19 first team players. Sorry to say but hardly any chance for Pizza, Can, Weiser, Weihrauch & PEH.
I guess Pizza should be content(O :P )-ed. Can's contract should be extended and he should be sent on loan. He's 19. So are Weiser and Weihrauch. They too should be sent on loan for the complete season.
PEH not necessarily. He's 17 only so time's on his side. Plus he should be pretty busy playing in UEFA Youth CL.

There all your problems solved. You can thank me now. :P
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby Firefox1234 » Sun Jul 14, 2013 5:25 am

The way i see this is that the 4-1-4-1 is like a blue print to build a house house and materials you use to build it is the lone #6. If I am going to build a house I want the materials I use to be as strong as I can make it and I feel or else the whole thing collapses. I feel like playing Schweinstiger instead of Martinez is like when the little pigs used hay and straw instead of brick to build their houses. Loew has shown us what happens when you decide to build your "4-1-4-1" house using hay and straw, it all gets blown away even if everything else fits.

Secondly i feel like ppl are underestimating Schweinstiger's skills as a #8, especially one in a 4-1-4-1. CMs in a 4-1-4-1 need to be dynamic attacking players who can take shots on goal and have the fitness to track back and help out in the defense. I think we can all agree that Schweinstiger fits that exact description of what is needed by a #8 in this formation. Schweinstiger is never shy to attack the box or take long shots and his fitness levels are as seen in the two legs vs Barca he is ready to track back and help out the defense.

But my main concern is the lone #6, if that position isnt filled with your strongest player who breaks up play in the midfield but is good enough with the ball that he can also initiate a counter attack then there is no point of even trying that formation all that awaits you is failure. I really hope Pep realizes that should be Martinez's role......
Last edited by Firefox1234 on Sun Jul 14, 2013 7:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby kod2600 » Sun Jul 14, 2013 7:01 am

I'm starting to feel that I'm over-thinking this. I'll just wait and see what Pep himself will do...
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:44 pm

Firefox1234 wrote:The way i see this is that the 4-1-4-1 is like a blue print to build a house house and materials you use to build it is the lone #6. If I am going to build a house I want the materials I use to be as strong as I can make it and I feel or else the whole thing collapses. I feel like playing Schweinstiger instead of Martinez is like when the little pigs used hay and straw instead of brick to build their houses. Loew has shown us what happens when you decide to build your "4-1-4-1" house using hay and straw, it all gets blown away even if everything else fits.

Secondly i feel like ppl are underestimating Schweinstiger's skills as a #8, especially one in a 4-1-4-1. CMs in a 4-1-4-1 need to be dynamic attacking players who can take shots on goal and have the fitness to track back and help out in the defense. I think we can all agree that Schweinstiger fits that exact description of what is needed by a #8 in this formation. Schweinstiger is never shy to attack the box or take long shots and his fitness levels are as seen in the two legs vs Barca he is ready to track back and help out the defense.

But my main concern is the lone #6, if that position isnt filled with your strongest player who breaks up play in the midfield but is good enough with the ball that he can also initiate a counter attack then there is no point of even trying that formation all that awaits you is failure. I really hope Pep realizes that should be Martinez's role......

I agree. At least if Pep wants Martinez at CB he should play Gustavo. In a 4-1-4-1 Schweinsteiger needs to have a more offensive role.
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby quaazi » Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:52 pm

Gustavo is a marvellous short passes, like Biscuits, but I doubt he is as good at letting the play flow through him as the latter. I do not think that Gustavo will make the first-choice midfield at this rate. Perhaps once Pep needs a left-footed midfielder-cum-centerback if (and this is a big elephant in the room in my opinion) Dante's performance levels start dropping once taken out of Jupp's (or Favre's, for that matter) solid defensive system.
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby BMpenang » Mon Jul 15, 2013 2:06 am

I'm having headache thinking about the formation and tactic for the coming season.
We were crying for a better bench but now we have almost 17 first team players.

I'll just wait and see with pep's tactics rather than work my brain off trying to guess.
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby panzer » Mon Jul 15, 2013 10:40 am

I think Pep will change the formation when Thiago comes. We will play in 4-3-3 formation. Pep will use him like Xavi. We are going to become Barca day by day. I think we will say bye bye Bayern, welcome Barca after a few month
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby ramsej84 » Mon Jul 15, 2013 11:11 am

You mean this:



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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby AdepT » Mon Jul 15, 2013 12:59 pm

What is this talk of us becoming Barca? That is impossible. You can't stop Robben or Ribery making their dribbles. Neither can you turn Mueller into Iniesta. So relax.
Our play is distinct because of the players and their styles. We may change the formation or tactics but you can't make our players play tika-taka like Barca. That is a hereditary disease. We already kept a lot of ball when we were not playing tika-taka. Pep will hardly increase that factor by 3-4%.

So calm down everyone and listen.
1. Schweini is a FussballGott.
2. Thiago is not here to start everymatch. Probably 15-20 starts and few sub performances. He is worried about boarding the WC plane. If we win BuLi and have a good run in CL(that is win it), Del Bosque is going to give him the ticket. Our wins will attract his attention. Much like in Gusta's case. He had less games in the second half but Scolari's made him a mainstay in the Brazil NT.
3. Thiago's game time will come out of Marti, Pizarro, and a bit of Schweini's playing time.
4. The problem is playing Martinez at CB. Pep has to make him feel good(:P). He really doesn't like that role. He has said it several times. If Pep forces him there, well then... I'd rather keep my words to myself.

How about we move into an Italian set-up with 3-5-2? Or may be a 3-4-3? :P
That could move in many CMs on the field. :lol:
Practically speaking, Pizarro's time is going to be close to nil. So will be the case with Rafinha, Contento, DvB & Can. Expect others to be satisfied.
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby Firefox1234 » Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:47 pm

I don't know why people think Schweinstiger can play as a lone DM, its never worked before so i doubt that changes under Pep:
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Mon Jul 15, 2013 2:41 pm

Firefox1234 wrote:I don't know why people think Schweinstiger can play as a lone DM, its never worked before so i doubt that changes under Pep:

I am sure that this is what we will see, or any other variation of it which makes it a 4-1-4-1 or 4-2-3-1
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Re: 2013/2014 Tactics & formations thread

Postby Firefox1234 » Mon Jul 15, 2013 7:01 pm

I think Pep played the likes of Mascherano as a CB because he had to not because he wanted to. I bet if Barca management would have bought him the likes of Silva this DM as CB stuff would never have been implimented as regulary as he did. Because if you watch Barca games Mascherano is as mistake prone playing CB as three Boateng's combined. I dont think Pep will play Martinez as CB with the likes of Dante, Boateng, Kirchhoff, Dvb, and potential Badstuber around...
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