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Spanish football

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Re: Spanish football

Postby aterford » Mon Aug 31, 2020 7:48 pm

FCBayernMunchen wrote:Barca are dead. The question is whether they will ever come back or whether they’re going down the Ajax road.


IMO it gets worse before it gets better.

Barca had ~500m in debts a few months ago. They're estimating something like 200m lost due to COVID and when all is said and done a 30% loss in revenue. Even the president has said it will basically take 2-3 years to recover from the COVID-situation alone, and that's not to say anything of the non-COVID tumult they're currently experiencing.

Rakitic goes for free.
Vidal wants out.
Suarez will be gone, but they are going to have to pay to get him to go.
The manager and SD have been fired.
6 members of the board have resigned in protest.
Veterans like Alba, Roberto, Busquets, and perhaps Pique will need to have their salaries reduced in order to stay.
You have Coutinho seemingly returning at 25m/yr wage.
The La Masia pipeline has largely dried up recently. With the exception of Puig and Fati, who are already being integrated into the team, there are not many players thought to be first-team potentials and hasn't really been many for a while.
They have the highest wage bill in the world currently, which makes up almost 75% of their entire turnover.

That would be bad enough on its own, but of course as we all know that's not even counting the biggest hit of all: that perhaps the greatest player of all time is now on strike and wants to leave. You can't just let him walk, of course, but what does it do for your club image if you fight tooth and nail to force him to stay against his will and sit on the sidelines the whole season?

Barcelona are perhaps in that too-big-to-fail category but it's really difficult at the moment to see much of a clear path forward right now and I have to imagine it gets much, much worse before things start looking up again. Not a ton of reasons for optimism if you're a Barca fan.
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Re: Spanish football

Postby Bazi » Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:11 pm

Barca's problem is that Bartomeu is not a rational president anymore. He has only two goals left:

- Avoid letting Messi leave under any circumstance
- Avoid leaving debt at the end of his tenure so him and his fellow directors are not personally liable for any of it

Everything else has been thrown out of the window alongside common sense and any sense of dignity that the club may have once possessed.

Still. Even if everything goes up in flames there's not enough competition in the Primera Division to challenge them in the top4 spots of the table. As long as they qualify for the Champions League they're going to be okay.

If Barto was smart he would cut his losses and negotiate with Manchester City a fee of 125-200M € for Messi to avoid an ugly legal battle so their club legend is allowed to leave with dignity which is what he deserves.

That would free up 225-300M € once you include Messi's massive salary. That's the kind of money Barca could have used on a player like van de Beek who has just joined United. You could sign Upamecano and a couple of other quality players as well. Maybe even Havartz.
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Re: Spanish football

Postby tuscanybayern » Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:44 pm

If you ask me, this complete collapse goes back to one moment:

23 July 2014

Barcelona signs 31 yo Jeremy Mathieu from Valencia for 20m euros with a 4+1 year deal worth 2.5m/year.

When I first heard the news back then I thought "WTF??" - that was indeed the beginning of the end for Barca. OK, they won the treble in 14/15 but after that they got every transfers completely wrong: flushing huge amounts of money for garbage/finished players like Paulinho (40m), Arda Turan (34m), Vermaelen (19m), Andre Gomes (37m), KP Boateng (1m loan), Alcacer (30m), Aleix Vidal (17m), Arturo Vidal (18m), Braithwaite (18m, 5 year contract), Semedo (30m), Umtiti(25m)

Absolute nonsense. Then you have Coutinho, Griezmann, Dembele of course....
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Re: Spanish football

Postby Fénix » Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:07 pm

It's incredible that such a great success during the last 11 years is crowned with a complete financial chaos and squad mess. In some way it's a huge paradox.

They didn't win 4 league titles in the last 11 seasons(2012, 2014, 2018 and 2020), won 3 CL titles and played so many CL semifinals and all those quarterfinals all those years.
If we add Spanish cups, super cups and CWC and Uefa Super Cups... There's no end of big number of trophies, money revenue, all pluses in financial terms, advantages to their name and reputation and dozens of other things.

I think it's all about their inferiority complex, giant arrogance over the last 15 years and extreme egomania and they have actually destroyed themselves for basically nothing, to shout how they are the best in everything and they aren't except in Copa del Rey titles. :)
That's why I have never liked them even before Ronaldinho and Rijkaard period and their controversial CL campaigns where they won 3 CL titles are uhhhhhh... in my younger days disgusting.

During all those years they gave up on so many values they cared about and said they would never allow themselves(kit sponsorship, Qatar Airways, etc.).

I hope Real Madrid and Atletico take advantage of this situation in La Liga and remove them for the next 5 years out of title race, but knowing these 2 Madrid clubs, they are also incompetent to win Primera in series. :)
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Re: Spanish football

Postby aterford » Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:19 pm

Bazi wrote:Barca's problem is that Bartomeu is not a rational president anymore. He has only two goals left:

- Avoid letting Messi leave under any circumstance
- Avoid leaving debt at the end of his tenure so him and his fellow directors are not personally liable for any of it

Everything else has been thrown out of the window alongside common sense and any sense of dignity that the club may have once possessed.

Still. Even if everything goes up in flames there's not enough competition in the Primera Division to challenge them in the top4 spots of the table. As long as they qualify for the Champions League they're going to be okay.

If Barto was smart he would cut his losses and negotiate with Manchester City a fee of 125-200M € for Messi to avoid an ugly legal battle so their club legend is allowed to leave with dignity which is what he deserves.

That would free up 225-300M € once you include Messi's massive salary. That's the kind of money Barca could have used on a player like van de Beek who has just joined United. You could sign Upamecano and a couple of other quality players as well. Maybe even Havartz.


Yep, exactly. And he's largely painted himself into a corner now. Hard to see how he gets out with any dignity really.
If he doesn't allow Messi to leave this year then he goes out in ~March as the president who let Barcelona lose Messi for free in 2021.
If he takes it to the courts, he's the guy who further disgraced the club by having to take legal action against their best player ever because he wanted to leave so badly.
If he lets him go for free now, he's the guy who made Barca lose Messi.
If he quits, Messi doesn't leave on his watch, but really everyone will remember him as the cause.
Only way to save face in the slightest bit is to get a decent transfer fee and let him go AND then invest smartly. But ultimately years from now when we talk about the Bartomeu era nobody is going to remember him for the trophies they won under his presidency. He will always be remembered as the President who made Messi leave Barcelona, that's his legacy now. Unless Bartomeu quits and somehow the new president/board convince Messi to stay (and we must acknowledge that even if this were somehow the case - things will always be different from this point. Some damage cannot be undone), that's how Bartomeu gets remembered when it's all said and done. Many will probably tell you that he'll go down as their worst-ever president, even after the trophies.

It's true though: unless they crash hard and teams like Sevilla or Villareal or Valencia or someone are able to somehow slip into those 3/4 spots (behind the Madrid teams) it's hard to see them missing UCL and falling too far. But at the same time in the post-Messi landscape it's really hard to see them seriously challenging for anything meaningful anytime soon.
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Re: Spanish football

Postby America USA » Fri Sep 04, 2020 10:48 pm

Messi que un club
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Re: Spanish football

Postby ramsej84 » Sat Sep 12, 2020 10:48 pm

Diego Simeone has tested positive for Covid. He was asymptomatic
U l-Kotra qamet f’daqqa – u għajtet: “Jien Maltija!
Miskin min ikasbarni, - miskin min jidħak bija!”
U l-Kotra għanniet f’daqqa – u semmgħet ma’ l-irjieħ
L-Innu ta’ Malta tagħna, – u l-leħen kien rebbieħ,
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