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European Football

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Re: European Football

Postby MUTU » Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:52 pm

Can't see tweet? Click here!

They decided? What, they have the arrogance to think UEFA and FIGC will bow down to their demands?
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Re: European Football

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:53 pm

MihailT wrote:
PunkCapitalist wrote:That would be ridiculous. We lost fair and square, it would be outrageous to now be revived and win it. Plus, a UCL without those 12 teams is worth exactly nothing.


I agree with you that we've been knocked out as per all the rules, and being reinstated in the competition is unfair.

However, that last statement is a myth at best, which is currently circulated as a defence for the secessionist ECL. So here are the facts:

8 out of those 12 teams (66.6%) have won a total of 0 UCLs in the past 10 years. Furthermore, Arsenal, Tottenham, Atl.Madrid and Manchester C. have never ever won it, period.

Since the introduction of the UCL, Liverpool have skipped more editions than they have taken part in.

Juventus has last lifted the title in the millenium, during which the Crusades took place, Istanbul was Constantinople, humans discovered North and South America as new continents, survived two devastating world wars, put a man on the Moon, and the West defeated the USSR in the Cold War.

Apart from Real Madrid, and Barcelona (which itself became a factor post-2009 due to the emergence of a single generationally exceptional player), there aren't any particularly spectacular teams to speak of. Hamburger and Benfica have as much claim to this "Super League" as half the teams on it. This has nothing to do with quality of football and tradition in the UCL - it's a money grab and attempted revolution.

I agree, although there's another side to it which MUTU just pointed out to me privately. Since 1995, only Ajax, BVB, Porto, and Bayern have won a CL and are not in the Super League.

What you mention is perhaps more relevant though. Milan were relevant then but aren't now. PSG were irrelevant then but are very likely to win the CL in the next few years (if not weeks) without or without teams being banned.
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Re: European Football

Postby MUTU » Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:56 pm

Nice way to fuck what I said. Since July 97, only Bayern and Porto won it ;)

There's considerably more prestige in those 12 ESL clubs than the rest of Europe combined.
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Re: European Football

Postby ramsej84 » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:08 pm

FIFPRO to ‘vigorously oppose’ players’ possible international ban

Let's go....

This is what gives back too much Rights
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Re: European Football

Postby MihailT » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:09 pm

I don't think it's "prestige", rather it's current "trendiness" and size of fanbase. What's prestigious about a club which cannot qualify for the UCL at all through its national league, or others which are Europa League level at best?

Otherwise, your argument stands surely, but why limit it to 1995, or 1997? Let's go back to the 1980's and include Aston Villa, Nottingham Forrest, PSV and Red Star Belgrade, as well?
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Re: European Football

Postby #12 » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:17 pm

Ottomeister87 wrote:Even if they exclude City, Chelski and RM from the CL now, just handing the trophy to PSG wouldnt be right either. Then i would postpone the rest of the complete event or make a KO round with the other 1/8 finalists that got eliminated who arent going with the SL ( yeah it wont be that many i know )

But the fans wont be able to do jack shit with it. Even if like the Bayern ultras would say, if Bayern would partake, we wont be in the stadium anymore bla bla bla. Its like what? A couple 1000 in the Sudkurve? Bayern has like 130k to 160k + inquiries for their home games. Those ultra's will just be replaced and that would suit KHR and Uli even better. So no, the fans wont be able to have any influence on the decision.

If this comes to fruition, the domestic leagues are doomed completely. No big stars anymore being able to be bought because of high price and enormous wages etc.

And IF i have to choose about facing Real every year 3 times or just seeing them play in the bundesliga. Then the bundesliga it is. CL always had this flair about facing top opponents ( though in the last 1o years we've played an awful lot against PSG, Atletico, Barca etc )
Those 130-160k just as well don’t understand why filthy rich assholes need even more of their hard earned money...
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Re: European Football

Postby Lahmies » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:26 pm

PunkCapitalist wrote:
That would be ridiculous. We lost fair and square, it would be outrageous to now be revived and win it. Plus, a UCL without those 12 teams is worth exactly nothing.


For you, maybe. I'd rather watch us play against teams who actually earned their sports there. I genuinely find that more exciting to watch, especially when small teams upset big teams in the CL. And with time, who's to say Leicester, Leeds, Sevilla won't become new big teams? Chelsea, Tottenham, City, were no one a decade or two ago.
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Re: European Football

Postby MUTU » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:34 pm

MihailT wrote:I don't think it's "prestige", rather it's current "trendiness" and size of fanbase. What's prestigious about a club which cannot qualify for the UCL at all through its national league, or others which are Europa League level at best?

Otherwise, your argument stands surely, but why limit it to 1995, or 1997? Let's go back to the 1980's and include Aston Villa, Nottingham Forrest, PSV and Red Star Belgrade, as well?



... Are you serious?
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Re: European Football

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:35 pm

The way I see it, if the international ban seems credible, then it is actually a great time for someone interested in investing in football to do so. Imagine you are a billionaire and you buy someone like Fiorentina. You can match (or come close to) the salaries these big clubs are paying their players while being able to lure them with the temptation of international football.
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Re: European Football

Postby MUTU » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:38 pm

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Re: European Football

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:41 pm

Doubtless the coming days will bring some clarity, as well as plenty more confusion. Resistance will come in many forms: protests, boycotts, strongly-worded radio phone-ins, the inevitable rebuke from a toothless parliamentary subcommittee. In the meantime, it is worth noting why Europe’s biggest clubs have decided to go now. Barcelona are £1bn in debt and facing one of the biggest financial crises in their history. Real Madrid were unable to afford a single big signing last summer. Juventus
have to find around £100m by the end of June. Internazionale’s owners sought emergency funding in February.

These are the most lucrative clubs in the most lucrative sport in the world: the sharpest minds, the smartest guys in the room. Are we really to believe that these galaxy brains can work together to organise a breakaway league when they can barely keep a roof over their heads?

Perhaps, for all the heartache and upheaval, this is the logical conclusion: you’ve been threatening to go it alone for years now. Well, guys: best of luck. [source]
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Re: European Football

Postby aterford » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:43 pm

Lahmies wrote:
PunkCapitalist wrote:
That would be ridiculous. We lost fair and square, it would be outrageous to now be revived and win it. Plus, a UCL without those 12 teams is worth exactly nothing.


For you, maybe. I'd rather watch us play against teams who actually earned their sports there. I genuinely find that more exciting to watch, especially when small teams upset big teams in the CL. And with time, who's to say Leicester, Leeds, Sevilla won't become new big teams? Chelsea, Tottenham, City, were no one a decade or two ago.


Agreed. Even with those 12 clubs gone, the list of potential 2021/22 UCL clubs looks like a really fun competition to me still. And if it's true that UEFA/FIFA will ban players from competing with their NT and that holds up...you may well see more and more players from these big 12 clubs want to leave to move to a non-ESL club in order to continue representing their country. As I said before...I think people are greatly overestimating how many good players would be willing to kill their NT career just for a potentially bigger wage at their club and playing in more "prestige" matches...
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Re: European Football

Postby T4L10N » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:46 pm

aterford wrote:
Agreed. Even with those 12 clubs gone, the list of potential 2021/22 UCL clubs looks like a really fun competition to me still. And if it's true that UEFA/FIFA will ban players from competing with their NT and that holds up...you may well see more and more players from these big 12 clubs want to leave to move to a non-ESL club in order to continue representing their country. As I said before...I think people are greatly overestimating how many good players would be willing to kill their NT career just for a potentially bigger wage at their club and playing in more "prestige" matches...


Exactly, I thinkg UEFA holds significant leverage here

... and no matter what those ESL teams do if we win next few CL because of this, I will be more than grateful. Its those clubs problem not ours. I dont remember anyone thinking 86-90 CC was inferior as English teams were banned from there. So if this continues as it stands right now, I prefer us to stay on this decision and win CL titles to catch with RM :coffee:
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Re: European Football

Postby aterford » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:51 pm

T4L10N wrote:
aterford wrote:
Agreed. Even with those 12 clubs gone, the list of potential 2021/22 UCL clubs looks like a really fun competition to me still. And if it's true that UEFA/FIFA will ban players from competing with their NT and that holds up...you may well see more and more players from these big 12 clubs want to leave to move to a non-ESL club in order to continue representing their country. As I said before...I think people are greatly overestimating how many good players would be willing to kill their NT career just for a potentially bigger wage at their club and playing in more "prestige" matches...


Exactly, I thinkg UEFA holds significant leverage here

... and no matter what those ESL teams do if we win next few CL because of this, I will be more than grateful. Its those clubs problem not ours. I dont remember anyone thinking 86-90 CC was inferior as English teams were banned from there. So if this continues as it stands right now, I prefer us to stay on this decision and win CL titles to catch with RM :coffee:


I mean Real Madrid basically Franco'd their way through a bunch of randos to their first 5 UCL titles or so in the first place, if they can statpad a couple of titles we might as well do the same
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Re: European Football

Postby T4L10N » Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:56 pm

aterford wrote:
I mean Real Madrid basically Franco'd their way through a bunch of randos to their first 5 UCL titles or so in the first place, if they can statpad a couple of titles we might as well do the same


Exactly, I want as many CL titles as possible and dont care if other clubs will or wont participate in it.
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