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[2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Discussions on the UEFA Champions League matches.
 

What is your prediction for this match?

Poll ended at Wed Oct 02, 2013 7:45 pm

Manchester City will win
1
4%
It will end in a draw
5
19%
Bayern Munich will win
20
77%
 
Total votes : 26

Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Firefox1234 » Fri Oct 04, 2013 10:20 pm

Total Football wrote:Manchester United have the Glazers. Manchester City have Sheikh Mansour. Chelsea have Roman Abramovich. Bayern Munich have Adidas, Audi etc. Did you even know Bayern Munich is partly owned by the likes of Adidas and Audi ? How much did the Allianz Arena cost ? Did you pay for it yourself ? no , ofcourse not, you took a loan. What is all this nonsense about "we have history" "we worked hard for our money" when in reality you take lots of loans all the time ?

I agree Bayern does have sponsors but do you how much of Bayern they own 81.9% of the clubs share are owned by Bayern Munich if you trust Wikipedia. Their isnt an owner Bayern can turn to for a huge cash injection like the clubs you just described, in the Bundesliga every club most own over 50% or what is known as the 50+1 rule. If Bayern were to go bankrupt they would have to find a way to rise back to the top by themselves just like Borussia Dortmund did. Also idk why you are blaming Bayern for taking out a loan, the point of a loan is that when you take one you have to pay it back, that is not the same as what PSG, Man C and Chelsea do. Those clubs dont have to pay back that money because their owners are personally funding those clubs, the loans Bayern took to build the Allianz is still in the process of being paid back through the clubs revenue not a rich owner.

Total Football wrote:+ you are engaged in alot of unethical things like raiding clubs who are trying to make progress ? are you afraid of being challenged by these smaller clubs ? why do you pay such huge wages ? perhaps bayern players arent proud to put on that red shirt .. they are mercenaries are they ?

LOL!!!! This isnt even worth answering! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby DerKaiser » Fri Oct 04, 2013 10:24 pm

Audi and Adidas have around 9% each the rest is owned by the fans....
Highest paid salaries of any sport team is Manshite City
As long as no-one scored, it was always going to be close.’ – Arsene Wenger
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Firefox1234 » Fri Oct 04, 2013 10:25 pm

Total Football wrote:its not a crime. but it seems that some posters here think its okay for bayern munich, real madrid, juventus et al should be allowed to take loans or finance but manchester city cannot do this , they must not do this ! otherwisse they are bad !

WOW... you sound very ignorant i already answered this in another post but what Man C, PSG, and Chelsea do isnt taking out a loan, that is their owners using their own money to fund the club so they can buy players and pay them high wages. The money owners put into their clubs isnt a loan because they club will not have to pay it back.

loan noun \ˈlōn\
: an amount of money that is given to someone for a period of time with a promise that it will be paid back


Note the key words paid back, the money Man C and clubs alike get will never have to be paid back but when Bayern ask for a loan that money will need to be paid back or else they will have to default and risk declaring bankruptcy
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Total Football » Fri Oct 04, 2013 10:27 pm

Firefox1234 wrote:
Total Football wrote:Also idk why you are blaming Bayern for taking out a loan, the point of a loan is that when you take one you have to pay it back, that is not the same as what PSG, Man C and Chelsea do. Those clubs dont have to pay back that money because their owners are personally funding those clubs, the loans Bayern took to build the Allianz is still in the process of being paid back through the clubs revenue not a rich owner.



You assume that PSG, Man C and Chelsea's owners pump unlimited amounts of money into their clubs without ever wanting to make that money back. Why ?
Total Football

 

Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Firefox1234 » Fri Oct 04, 2013 10:34 pm

Total Football wrote:You assume that PSG, Man C and Chelsea's owners pump unlimited amounts of money into their clubs without ever wanting to make that money back. Why ?

Okay fair point but the problem is the fact they have owners to pump money into the team, idk if you know anything about credit but to gain credit you have to prove to the bank or whoever you usually take a loan from that you can pay the money back or else they wont loan you any money. By having rich owners to fund them Man C, PSG, and Chelsea have bypassed that process since they have rich owners who will fund them without worrying about being paid back like what a normal institution would do. For example why would you go ask the bank for a million euro loan knowing that it would be a hassle to get it or you wont get it at all when you can just go to an outside source who would give it to you no questions asked. That is why a small club cant ask for an 200m transfer kit cause if they were take a loan the usual way(through a bank)they would be denied cause their revenue stream wouldnt allow them to pay the loan back. Unlike if your Man C your owner is willing to take that chance since he isnt gonna sweat losing that much money since its from his own pocket....
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Borusse » Fri Oct 04, 2013 10:55 pm

Ban him please. He is disturbing the peace and quiet of this community. :evil: Even I dont like that, only I can bring chaos to conversations around here!
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Firefox1234 » Fri Oct 04, 2013 10:57 pm

Borusse wrote:Ban him please. He is disturbing the peace and quiet of this community. :evil: Even I dont like that, only I can bring chaos to conversations around here!

Tbh the dude sounds a bit misguided, i cant speak for MUTU or the other mods but i would give him a chance. He has made some interesting points and i would like to see what else he has to say....
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Total Football » Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:17 pm

Firefox1234 wrote:
Total Football wrote:You assume that PSG, Man C and Chelsea's owners pump unlimited amounts of money into their clubs without ever wanting to make that money back. Why ?

the problem is the fact they have owners to pump money into the team,


why is that a problem ?
Total Football

 

Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Tedesco » Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:20 pm

Total Football wrote:
Firefox1234 wrote:
Total Football wrote:You assume that PSG, Man C and Chelsea's owners pump unlimited amounts of money into their clubs without ever wanting to make that money back. Why ?

the problem is the fact they have owners to pump money into the team,


why is that a problem ?

Because it is artificial. There was no work from the club to earn that kind of cash.
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby runaway » Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:22 pm

Everything you're saying is the same shit, people in internet articles spout. :roll: There's no arguing to someone who thinks we're so evil, and buys up Bundesliga. Do some research and see that it is Bundesliga's culture to buy, sell, and loan within the league because it's easier to buy players who's already playing and is adjusted in Germany's condition. PL doesn't have that because the local talent is limited and there are cheaper options abroad. La Liga clubs buy more often in La Liga. German clubs even loan their players to top competitors unlike what Mourinho did to Ba.

The only reason City is not sanctioned by UEFA is because their is the probability they can earn the money back. They lost 200million in 2010-11 and 97 million in 2011-2012. They charge, 70 pounds as the cheapest, for stadium tickets.

For a heartless bastard, like Bayern, how dare we give a loan to Dortmund when they needed it. We could have let them sort themselves out and just reign Bundesliga for all the years to come. Bayern's tickets range from 35 euros to 70 euros. We have been on a profit for over 2 decades now.

This is an interesting blog that analyzes clubs' finances. If you have the time, read both articles of Bayern and City.
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Total Football » Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:24 pm

Tedesco wrote:Because it is artificial. There was no work from the club to earn that kind of cash.


when bayern munich was first founded. it needed money. people poured money into the club. there was no work from the club itself. do you criticize this act of pouring money into a club ?
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Firefox1234 » Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:25 pm

Total Football wrote:
Firefox1234 wrote:
Total Football wrote:You assume that PSG, Man C and Chelsea's owners pump unlimited amounts of money into their clubs without ever wanting to make that money back. Why ?

the problem is the fact they have owners to pump money into the team,


why is that a problem ?

It inflates the market which could create financial problems for teams across Europe, especially the smaller teams. Because teams like Man C are having these huge cash injections so quickly they are able to increase the value of players in the transfer market which causes small clubs especially to sink even more into debt because the market is so inflated. Also the wages are getting higher that is why cases where teams are not able to pay player wages is growing because these small teams cannot compete with the sudden increase in average wages across Europe cause of these oil backed clubs. FFP is made to make sure clubs cant rely on an owners solely funding a club, clubs are allowed a certain amount of debt but they must show they are keeping their revenue streams healthy. Also clubs that fail to pay player wages or dont keep revenue streams healthy are not allowed to enter UEFA based competitions which could mean even further financial damage for the club. Even the English Premiere has introduced its own version of FFP to address this issue....

http://www.financialfairplay.co.uk/
Last edited by Firefox1234 on Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby paullepage » Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:26 pm

Total Football wrote:
DerKaiser wrote:Bayern relies neither on debt nor a single investor, who could leave the club at any time. Instead, fans own nearly 82 percent of Bayern


complete and utter nonsense.

bayern munich took a loan to build their stadium.

i could go on.


Do you have any idea how much it costs to build a stadium? You say that like they did something wrong.

I'm not a a bayern munich fan but it is common knowledge that they are one of the most responsibly run clubs around. you don't have to like them but some of your arguments are just ridiculous in my opinion.


You can only beat what is in front of you. Whatever you think of man city or pellegrini or Joe Hart, they showed up and got their asses beat. We'll see what happens in the next game but for now let the fans enjoy their win.

It hurt watching them beat my team 7-0 last season but u just have to take it and move on. Trying to blow out someone else's light doesn't necessarily make your's shine any brighter. Losing to Bayern doesn't make Man City any less of a strong team it just means they lost one game.
Last edited by paullepage on Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Total Football » Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:28 pm

runaway wrote:The only reason City is not sanctioned by UEFA


why would they be sanctioned. they aren't doing anything illegal.

the concept of investing in a business with the hope of getting a return on that investment is something ancient. its not insane or weird.
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Re: [2013-10-02] Manchester City vs Bayern Munich

Postby Total Football » Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:31 pm

paullepage wrote:
Total Football wrote:
DerKaiser wrote:Bayern relies neither on debt nor a single investor, who could leave the club at any time. Instead, fans own nearly 82 percent of Bayern


complete and utter nonsense.

bayern munich took a loan to build their stadium.

i could go on.


Do you have any idea how much it costs to build a stadium? You say that like they did something wrong.

I'm not a a bayern munich fan but it is common knowledge that they are one of the most responsibly run clubs around. you don't have to like them but some of your arguments are just ridiculous in my opinion.


You can only beat what is in front of you. Whatever you think of man city or pellegrini or Joe Hart, they showed up and got their asses beat. We'll see what happens in the next game but for now let the fans enjoy their win.

It hurt watching them beat my team 7-0 last season but u just have to take it and move on. Trying to blow someone else's light doesn't necessarily make your's shine any brighter. Losing to Bayern doesn't make Man City any less of a strong team it just means they lost one game.


dude, i only said that bayern munich had it easy. its an opinion. i can understand why bayern fans here dont like to hear that but that is my opinion.
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