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[2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Discussions on the UEFA Champions League matches.
 

What is your prediction for this match?

Poll ended at Tue May 12, 2015 7:45 pm

Bayern Munich will win
18
51%
It will end in a draw
2
6%
FC Barcelona will win
15
43%
 
Total votes : 35

Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby Aequitas1987 » Thu May 14, 2015 6:52 am

Its easy to be an armchair tactician without going into many details and then blaming the coach. Barcelona has been the possession gods for the last decade, we recently usurped that title from them. When going against Barcelona, everyone knows, especially Pep that when they don't have the ball they are practically shaky all over the pitch.

Then the question arises how do we beat them at their own possession game? Intense pressing in their half and in the middle of the field with constant turnovers and cutting off the supply to their attacking trio. Forcing Barcelona to go for long Lobs/Throughpasses which if our defensive unit works properly beats them by winning the headers or playing them offside.

Then you look at the resulting tactics; the 'sucidal' high line according to some of you peeps is what was absolutely necessary to execute these tactics to perfection, provided that our pressing was as intense as the last half of the tie. We didn't do that level of pressing in the first half and we played poor offisde traps due to Benatia/Boateng/Rafinha/Bernat having lack of chemistry. Trust me you throw either Martinez (if fully fit) or Alaba along with Benatia and Boateng and the offisde trap would have worked flawlessly.

And for all you people who think we should have played differently, what is your grand alternative tactically? Jupp's Bayern? Look at the players he had to his disposal compared to Pep. We didn't have the width he had with Robbery. Jupp played a contained pressing game, where he lulled Barcelona into a certain area and then aggressively pressed as a unit to win the ball and go for the counter. Do you see any fast players outside of Muller for us to counter with? You want to counter with Muller, Schweinsteiger, Gotze? Not going to happen. Secondly, giving possession to this Barcelona team and allowing their front three to link up is just asking to be slaughtered. All three individually are giant threats and the more time you give them on the ball the more dangerous they get, stopping all three is not easy at all.

Guardiola got the tactics almost right; maybe Martinez should have started in the 3 man defense. If most of the team were fitter (Thiago, Lahm, Schweinsteiger, Lewandowski, Alonso, Benatia) then our pressing game could have been better and we would have won this tie similar to Jupp's Bayern. Lack of chemistry, injuries and lack of fitness for the high intensity pressing game are to blame.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby Abc456 » Thu May 14, 2015 7:02 am

Aequitas1987 wrote:Its easy to be an armchair tactician without going into many details and then blaming the coach. Barcelona has been the possession gods for the last decade, we recently usurped that title from them. When going against Barcelona, everyone knows, especially Pep that when they don't have the ball they are practically shaky all over the pitch.

Then the question arises how do we beat them at their own possession game? Intense pressing in their half and in the middle of the field with constant turnovers and cutting off the supply to their attacking trio. Forcing Barcelona to go for long Lobs/Throughpasses which if our defensive unit works properly beats them by winning the headers or playing them offside.

Then you look at the resulting tactics; the 'sucidal' high line according to some of you peeps is what was absolutely necessary to execute these tactics to perfection, provided that our pressing was as intense as the last half of the tie. We didn't do that level of pressing in the first half and we played poor offisde traps due to Benatia/Boateng/Rafinha/Bernat having lack of chemistry. Trust me you throw either Martinez (if fully fit) or Alaba along with Benatia and Boateng and the offisde trap would have worked flawlessly.

And for all you people who think we should have played differently, what is your grand alternative tactically? Jupp's Bayern? Look at the players he had to his disposal compared to Pep. We didn't have the width he had with Robbery. Jupp played a contained pressing game, where he lulled Barcelona into a certain area and then aggressively pressed as a unit to win the ball and go for the counter. Do you see any fast players outside of Muller for us to counter with? You want to counter with Muller, Schweinsteiger, Gotze? Not going to happen. Secondly, giving possession to this Barcelona team and allowing their front three to link up is just asking to be slaughtered. All three individually are giant threats and the more time you give them on the ball the more dangerous they get, stopping all three is not easy at all.

Guardiola got the tactics almost right; maybe Martinez should have started in the 3 man defense. If most of the team were fitter (Thiago, Lahm, Schweinsteiger, Lewandowski, Alonso, Benatia) then our pressing game could have been better and we would have won this tie similar to Jupp's Bayern. Lack of chemistry, injuries and lack of fitness for the high intensity pressing game are to blame.



Guardiola did not get tactics right and blaming injuries is not an excuse. The high line is stupid and he has been doing it since he came to bayern and 3 man defense is useless . Robbery could not have stopped the goals barca scored . The tactics were exactly the same against Madrid last year what happened then we had everyone fit and lost 5-0 . I have had enough of Pep's justification truth is he never wanted to beat barcelona and his interviews tell us that. If malaga can beat barca at nou camp why can't we?
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby sch0ll7 » Thu May 14, 2015 9:00 am

Abc456 wrote:Guardiola did not get tactics right and blaming injuries is not an excuse. The high line is stupid and he has been doing it since he came to bayern and 3 man defense is useless .



can you please tell us what tactics would you want him to use with the players he had at his disposal?
this is a serious question.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby Abc456 » Thu May 14, 2015 9:05 am

lahm , benatia , boateng and bernat at the back with rode , alonso dm , schweinstiger , gotze and muller as attacking midfielders and lewandowski upfront with a tight defense and catching barca on the counter.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby RedQueen » Thu May 14, 2015 9:12 am

sch0ll7 wrote:What's up with all the Pep hate?

I see that most of you trying to discredit Pep are new at football or at least at FC Bayern.

Or maybe they are new to neither, and have merely registered fairly recently at this forum. Cheap attempt at discrediting people who don't agree with you, and that from a mod.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby Dumbledore7 » Thu May 14, 2015 9:15 am

RedQueen wrote:
sch0ll7 wrote:What's up with all the Pep hate?

I see that most of you trying to discredit Pep are new at football or at least at FC Bayern.

Or maybe they are new to neither, and have merely registered fairly recently at this forum. Cheap attempt at discrediting people who don't agree with you, and that from a mod.


Criticising is pretty much fine, I don't think even Pep's most devoted supporters can justify the public Messi and Barcelona love spread. Some of the pure hate here are kind of ridiculous, though. Not even a speck of Mia San Mia at all.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby MUTU » Thu May 14, 2015 9:16 am

Abc456 wrote:lahm , benatia , boateng and bernat at the back with rode , alonso dm , schweinstiger , gotze and muller as attacking midfielders and lewandowski upfront with a tight defense and catching barca on the counter.

Rode was injured for the first leg. In the second leg we couldn't play counters since we needed to score.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby Abc456 » Thu May 14, 2015 9:21 am

MUTU wrote:
Abc456 wrote:lahm , benatia , boateng and bernat at the back with rode , alonso dm , schweinstiger , gotze and muller as attacking midfielders and lewandowski upfront with a tight defense and catching barca on the counter.

Rode was injured for the first leg. In the second leg we couldn't play counters since we needed to score.


Ok we could have played thiago at am and schweinstiger at dm. As far as second leg is concerned we scored early of a set piece and if we hadn't conceded the two goals having a tight defense it may have went to extra time.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby RedQueen » Thu May 14, 2015 9:21 am

Dumbledore7 wrote:Criticising is pretty much fine, I don't think even Pep's most devoted supporters can justify the public Messi and Barcelona love spread. Some of the pure hate here are kind of ridiculous, though. Not even a speck of Mia San Mia at all.

But what has that got to do with allegedly being new to FC Bayern, let alone football? In Germany those who hate Pep guts seem to be mostly the long-term fans who have been with both football and FC Bayern for ages.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby Dumbledore7 » Thu May 14, 2015 9:32 am

RedQueen wrote:But what has that got to do with allegedly being new to FC Bayern, let alone football? In Germany those who hate Pep guts seem to be mostly the long-term fans who have been with both football and FC Bayern for ages.


The way I see it, not too long ago we were always the underdog in Europe and we've kinda been through a lot worse really. Therefore I personally hardly complain the last couple of years but that's just me. Some of the criticism points I see you brought about Pep are spot on, as with a number of people here. The other bunch meanwhile are just...hating. If these people were in Munich they'd be the one smashing his car like Madrid's doing with Bale. That's way beneath Bayern, hence why the haters, allegedly, probably aren't really Bayern enough or just bandwagoners.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby Abc456 » Thu May 14, 2015 9:34 am

That is why I am trying to say that this is Bayern's golden generation and we if we are to win then this is the time. When this precious time will pass we I don't think like madrid , chelsea will be able to spend big and compete at this level.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby ramsej84 » Thu May 14, 2015 9:51 am

RedQueen wrote:
Dumbledore7 wrote:Criticising is pretty much fine, I don't think even Pep's most devoted supporters can justify the public Messi and Barcelona love spread. Some of the pure hate here are kind of ridiculous, though. Not even a speck of Mia San Mia at all.

But what has that got to do with allegedly being new to FC Bayern, let alone football? In Germany those who hate Pep guts seem to be mostly the long-term fans who have been with both football and FC Bayern for ages.


Precisely... I think it is him who hasn't got the Bayern culture in him... but whatever...
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby sch0ll7 » Thu May 14, 2015 10:46 am

Abc456 wrote:lahm , benatia , boateng and bernat at the back with rode , alonso dm , schweinstiger , gotze and muller as attacking midfielders and lewandowski upfront with a tight defense and catching barca on the counter.


That would be a slaughter. You are still dreaming about that game 2 years ago where we had Ribery, Robben and Alaba who were directly responsible for 5 goals which all came from counter attacks. other 2 goals came from set pieces.
Barcelona was not the same barca as this one. They didnt have Neymar and Suarez and Messi was not in top form.

First two goals we conceded in Barcelona were not counters or because of the "high-line"...both goals came from Messi doing his thing...and our defenders not able to take tackle or block the shots.
And 2 other goals at AA were conceded because our defenders couldnt handle that trio. Neymar, messi and suarez against our 7 defenders...and they manage to score.
Second goal was a counter attack but...you see messi winning a header against schweini and benatia...and passing it to suarez who was running onto the ball.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby Abc456 » Thu May 14, 2015 10:55 am

Just admit it in 4-5 years we will become the same european underdog we were 6 years ago and the credit goes to freaking Pep Guardiola.
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Re: [2015-05-12] Bayern Munich vs FC Barcelona

Postby sch0ll7 » Thu May 14, 2015 11:01 am

RedQueen wrote:Or maybe they are new to neither, and have merely registered fairly recently at this forum. Cheap attempt at discrediting people who don't agree with you, and that from a mod.


sorry if I somehow offended you...

Dont get me wrong...I like to debate but...writing about how Pep doesnt have Bayern blood and isnt all-in with us and his child watching messi play on TV...and the best of all..."he never wanted to win against barca"...and that is why someone wants him gone is silly.

Noone denies he has made some tactical mistakes since he joined us. But every coach does that. This is football. But I rather have Pep making few mistakes per season than what Klopp did with Dortmund...mistake after mistake...for 8 straight months. But the funny thing is that most of you still prefer Klopp. I must say Klopp is one of the best coaches around and I rate him highly...but just wanted to show you how every coach makes tactical mistakes....some more than others.

And some write about how munchen-based fans want him out etc...that is just pure nonsense...I know a lot of people I am in contact with and they are mostly satisfied with his work. And I believe that 90% of fans that go to the stadium are happy with him and how our team did this season.
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