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2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Discussions on the UEFA Champions League matches.
 

How will Bayern do in the 2020/21 Champions League?

Only reach the Quarter-Finals
2
11%
Only reach the Semi-Finals
3
16%
Reach the Finals and Win
14
74%
Reach the Finals but Lose
0
No votes
 
Total votes : 19

Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby PunkCapitalist » Fri Feb 19, 2021 1:18 am

aterford wrote:
PunkCapitalist wrote:I don't think it was the wrong choice at all. Ronaldo would not have won another CL for Madrid. They wasted the money on Hazard, which was a horrible decision, but it was still a big sum they could have used far better.

You're right that Madrid didn't trade Ronaldo + cash for a replacement, but that is because the replacement was just not available. If they could have given Ronaldo + cash for Mbappe I'm 100% sure they would have taken the deal.

I say it's a small sample in the sense that there have only been 2 players that are candidates to "best in the world" for a decade and a half, hence any potential movement would have to involve either of them and neither was old until now.

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I mean, hindsight is 20/20, I guess, but I think you'd be hard-pressed to argue that Madrid wouldn't be better off right now if they'd just kept Ronaldo. If they never sold him, never got that money, and never bought Hazard, would they really be in a worse spot? I sure don't think so. And of course - while they overpaid - Hazard was still widely regarded as one of the best players in the Premier League and (again, hindsight is 20/20) the criticisms of that signing generally didn't come until later.

In whatever case, that's neither here nor there. There's no reason to limit it to just the last decade or the era of Ronaldo and Messi. Feel free to go back as far as you need to. Beyond Ronaldo to Juve in a straight cash deal - has there EVER been any example in the history of the sport for such a deal as is being proposed?
Can't think of one, but i still think it would be best. I mean, the whole "deal" we're discussing is completely unrealistic. Lewandowski wouldn't want to go to BVB in any case and I doubt they would take him if it meant giving away Haaland without getting obscene money. But the real question is whether it would make sense to sell Lewy, add cash and buy his successor. IMO, if the successor was very very clear, it would make sense. That is exactly what Madrid tried to do with Ronaldo and IMO it was the right choice even if they missed at the purchase for whatever reason.

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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby aterford » Fri Feb 19, 2021 1:24 am

Yeah, I guess looking for precedence is ultimately missing the forest for the trees, haha. As you said, BVB wouldn't agree to such a deal, Lewandowski almost certainly wouldn't, and I doubt we'd treat a player like that either. In the event that Lewy advocated for such a move himself, and BVB and Haaland were willing to make it happen, then I'd probably be for it too, but hard to see those circumstances happening.

I do also get a sense that - for better or worse - I don't know why but I've always had a feeling that Haaland doesn't view Bayern as a "destination" club, I suspect if he joined us then sooner or later he'd probably be wanting a move to Madrid or Barca or one of the top PL clubs. Of course that's just speculation (and things can change once you actually secure a player), but if Haaland were to join this summer and ask for a move in 3 years or something, I'm not sure that would really leave us in a better position (both then and in the time between now and then) than we'd have been in if we'd just kept Lewandowski for a couple more years and started searching in earnest for his successor in ~2 years or so. In other words: having Haaland for say 21/22, 22/23, and 23/24 would sure be nice, but if he were to want a big move in 2024 or something...is that a huge advantage over keeping Lewy for 21/22, 22/23, and splashing on a new striker in 2023, for example? I just don't know!
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby Awax » Fri Feb 19, 2021 4:01 am

aterford wrote:... I do also get a sense that - for better or worse - I don't know why but I've always had a feeling that Haaland doesn't view Bayern as a "destination" club, I suspect if he joined us then sooner or later he'd probably be wanting a move to Madrid or Barca or one of the top PL clubs...


He's rare breed. Every club that's financially capable will be pursuing him. With an agent like his, he knows very well how his worth and the appeal he has. They will be going for a blockbuster move. I too don't see him staying in the Bundesliga and switch to Bayern, regardless of Lewandowski.
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby aterford » Fri Feb 19, 2021 5:32 am

Awax wrote:
aterford wrote:... I do also get a sense that - for better or worse - I don't know why but I've always had a feeling that Haaland doesn't view Bayern as a "destination" club, I suspect if he joined us then sooner or later he'd probably be wanting a move to Madrid or Barca or one of the top PL clubs...


He's rare breed. Every club that's financially capable will be pursuing him. With an agent like his, he knows very well how his worth and the appeal he has. They will be going for a blockbuster move. I too don't see him staying in the Bundesliga and switch to Bayern, regardless of Lewandowski.


Yeah. Kind of what I mean. Raiola client. He knows it's often beneficial to make a couple of moves, rather than just one straightaway. Like...Haaland was a big rumored United target, but - in spite of their current status - United are more of a "destination club" than BVB are. There's more almost certainly more money for Raiola and Haaland in going to BVB, raising his profile, and THEN moving to a bigger club than there would have been just moving straight to United, for example.
In the same way... assuming Haaland stays on his current trajectory, he'd stand to make more (and sell for more - therefore higher agent fee) if he were sold from Bayern rather than BVB, for example.

Just like moving to BVB as an intermediary club would serve to improve both of their earnings, I think in that sense...if he were to move to Bayern, he'd be able to move in his prime (~24-25) to a club like United or Madrid or whoever. Ergo, if they're (Haaland+Raiola) looking to maximize value/earnings, they'd earn more by moving from Salzburg to BVB to Bayern to (Madrid, United, etc) than they would by moving from Salzburg-BVB-Madrid/United/Etc, just like it's better for earnings to move from Salzburg to BVB first than from Salzburg straight to United, for example.

All that to say: we got lucky in landing Lewandowski right in his prime and managing to get him in a contract situation that allowed us to basically dictate whether or not he had the opportunity to move or not (and of course: he tried!). But I don't think we'd have that same situation with Haaland. If he joins this year, he joins at 20/21. Were he to join in 2022, then of course he's 21/22. With a 5-year contract, he'd be able to leave for free in 2026 or 2027 at age 25, 26 at the latest - right in the thick of his prime. And that'd be a free deal, which might be the way to go, but if not he'd perhaps want to leave in 2024, 2025.

And of course it may be that having a few years of Haaland is better than none, but I just feel like...even if we somehow managed to convince him to join us and worked out a deal to make it so...I suspect we don't get him to a second contract. And as above: that would pretty much put it right back to square one, so we again have to ask - of course it's hypothetical, but is having Haaland from say age 20-24 *that* much of an improvement over having Lewandowski from now until 35?

Like I've said before, I'd love to see him here, but it's hard to see him getting here and it's probably just as hard to see us finding a way to convince him to stay here beyond his initial contract. So, I just don't know.
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby YlonenXabi » Fri Feb 19, 2021 5:58 am

PunkCapitalist wrote: That is exactly what Madrid tried to do with Ronaldo


They didn't want to sell him. They would have been more than happy to keep Ronaldo in the team.

However Ronaldo was asking for way more money as he was due to pay a HUGE sum to the Spanish Tax Authorities and Florentino was not willing to accept those salary demands considering his age and his more than astronomical wages. Kind of like the current Sergio Ramos situation, just that Sergio doesn't have any issues with the Tax Agency as far as I know

I think that high earners like footballers have to pay less tax in Italy and that's probably why Ronaldo opted for Juventus.




Lewandowski is the best player in the world. I know that Haaland is an absolute monster, but he's not at Lewy's level yet. Football is not only about scoring goals. It's about performing and delivering in big moments when your team needs you

Lewy has been consistenly scoring 40+ goals for almost 10 years. A young Lewy scored 4 goals against a very strong Real Madrid side in a CL semi final. That Lewy was a monster too, but not even close to what he is now as he's gained way more experience.

Haaland is very likely to be as good as Lewy and I would definitely bet on it. I think we all agree with that. I would love to have him as Lewy's replacement.

However it remains to be seen if he can perform at a world class level consistently every year in every competition and playing for a big club. Once he's done that then we could confirm he's reached Lewy's level. And I'm not even talking about winning the Best Player award or the Sextuple :coffee:

Not that long ago some users were asking for Piatek or Jovic as Lewy replacement and look at them now. Dembele was a no brainer when he was playing for Dortmund but he failed miserably in Barcelona. In 2018 I was claiming that Hazard would take us to the next level and would have laughed at whoever mentioned that Gnabry was gonna by way better for us :oops:
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby vtotheinay » Wed Feb 24, 2021 9:22 pm

wow absolutely ridiculous red card on the atalanta defender just now vs madrid. the favoritism they get from referees in the CL is so insane. the ref didn't even check VAR to see if it was the right decision! what a joke
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby Achilles » Wed Feb 24, 2021 9:32 pm

Such a shame for Gladbach to conceded
They were doing ok actually but..

Zakaria is our guy from Gladbach. Every time I see him play he always involved in critical areas on the field and he plays excellent. He'll click right away with Kimmich & Leon.
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby PunkCapitalist » Wed Feb 24, 2021 9:34 pm

Achilles wrote:Such a shame for Gladbach to conceded
They were doing ok actually but..

Zakaria is our guy from Gladbach. Every time I see him play he always involved in critical areas on the field and he plays excellent. He'll click right away with Kimmich & Leon.
They were letting Shitty have 100% of posession, it was a matter of time for them to concede.

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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Wed Feb 24, 2021 9:46 pm

Embarrassing by Gladbach if you ask me. Not a single shot or corner and only one real attack. They're way better than this but they decided to park the bus completely.
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby ramsej84 » Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:00 pm

vtotheinay wrote:wow absolutely ridiculous red card on the atalanta defender just now vs madrid. the favoritism they get from referees in the CL is so insane. the ref didn't even check VAR to see if it was the right decision! what a joke
Without watching the incident I kind felt that it was a ridiculous decision....

Bastards....

Uefa knows that Real are in deep shit... so they give them a helping hand
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby Lukas » Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:01 pm

Yeah I switched the Gladbach match off after 20 minutes. Was almost like they couldn’t be bothered and were protesting against the neutral venue. Probably weren’t but that’s what it looked like
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby ramsej84 » Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:43 pm

Who is this spineless corrupt son of a bitch ... of a ref????

This is corruption of the most highest order... disgusting ... in our fucking faces


Casemiro already booked dived in the atalanta area and the ref did not give him the second yellow thus sparing him the sent off

Edit
Ohhhh fucking fuck.... of course he is a spinless sob.... he is German. Ref some of the worse around

And of course the white bastards just scored....
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby Fénix » Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:58 pm

Haha, Stieler should not be a referee on this level of football, that's what a Croatian match commentator said during the match. :lol: :lol:

UEFA did their homework well. VAR can be bypassed in many other ways. :mrgreen: Only naive folks thought it would change some old habits.

It's always been about names, countries, nations, history, etc. The part I don't like at all, German referees became bad over the last 11 years and before that were considered as righteous, rational, fair, top stuff, etc.
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby ramsej84 » Wed Feb 24, 2021 11:01 pm

First leg...
The only tm to win at home is FCPorto
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Re: 2020/21 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby #12 » Wed Feb 24, 2021 11:11 pm

ramsej84 wrote:First leg...
The only tm to win at home is FCPorto
Because all the home games are conducted at the homes of runners up...
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