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Robert Lewandowski

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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby America USA » Wed Sep 13, 2017 5:17 pm

^ I know the rules MUTU. It's just that his contention was so preposterous it made me lose my mind! But whatever sails their boat I guess.

EDIT: Yes Robben has been selfish many times in the past but that doesn't mean other guys should try to emulate his negative traits. Two Wrongs don't make a Right!
Last edited by America USA on Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby MasterBlaster » Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:15 pm

it is funny how people that someone could beat Robben with selfishness. It's just impossible. Robben's selfishness is only tolerated through years becouse of his awsome skills. And this is reason why Robben with Lewy will never be teammates. Lewy is tired to waiting for Robben to pass after these years. It is how it really is. Ribbery is likely to pass so Lewy likes to play with him, Muller is never selfish, so Lewy likes to play with him even more. And it was 2-0, with that advantage forwards players (Bayern players especially) always are more selfish and try own luck.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby aterford » Wed Sep 13, 2017 9:19 pm

Robben is selfish.

That's fine. We all acknowledge this.

Lewy is acting worse right now.
Let's stop deflecting and saying "what about Robben though???"
This is the Lewandowski thread. We are talking about Lewandowski and his behavior ALONE. Robben's behavior in the past and present has NOTHING to do with how Lewy acts.

If you wanna complain about Robben's antics, take it to the Robben thread. Otherwise, try and keep the issues separate. Lewy's issues are his own.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby Achilles » Wed Sep 13, 2017 9:20 pm

Bashing Lewandowski for his reaction after Kimmich goal is getting us closer to paranoia. Completely nonsense.
The game was over(home vs Anderlecht,ten man,2-0 winning) and it was a "sure" pass from Kimmich 9 to 10 times the RB would pass, it's an instinct reaction from not getting the certain pass/score and it was a harmless goal, a beautiful one but on the corpse of Anderlecht.

Lewandowski DOESN'T get the support that other strikers of RM,Barca,Juve or PSG getting, that's mostly due to crap or non-existent offensive tactics(plus Arjen ofc) and bad form of our wingers/midfielders they don't penetrate enough to make ways for the extra pass or the through ball with Lewy being the receiver in other words we don't work as a normal offensive team. I completely understand him in that matter but he over exaggerates sometimes. He is a selfish b4stard but he is a top-3 striker for a long time now, he wouldn't be in that category if he wasn't selfish.

At the moment almost every player looks on the field pretty messed up with no passion, thing is that Lewy got all eyes on him because of his lately unnecessary interview because he is the No.1 star on our team having many fans and of course because of his attitude when he doesn't gets feed properly. Fortunately!!! we're shaping our new world class player, Joshua Kimmich, plays fantastic, scoring & assisting and it's a regular starter.
That's the only positive right now.

*Ribery needs a fine,needs something, we can't tolerate his demands of being a regular and absolute star anymore. He can't.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby Ziklitschli » Wed Sep 13, 2017 9:59 pm

America USA wrote:^ I know the rules MUTU. It's just that his contention was so preposterous it made me lose my mind! But whatever sails their boat I guess.


It's an entire school of thought that strikers need to be selfish

https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... tin-oneill

and Lewandowski in fact, is middling in that category at best. I was serious, even when in a predatory form he tends to pass too much, something surely Guardiola automated into him and I would like to see what would happen if he dropped those shackles.

btw his diving, sth he is criticised a lot for, is probably another thing Guardiola taught him

Preposterous is actualy a good word for all the reactions surronding Lewa and the events on the pitch. Sell him, dead man, bad egg, at least if it was Muller he ignored. Why pass to Robben, explain himself or apologise, he obviously won't return the favour the next time anyway.

America USA wrote:EDIT: Yes Robben has been selfish many times in the past but that doesn't mean other guys should try to emulate his negative traits. Two Wrongs don't make a Right!


Roben's selfishness might be a crucial trait of his, one that makes him a WC player and such a threat. I can't say whether his drive can exist without his ego, can you?

Anyway, I have nothing against Robben,just the double standards are weird.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby Ziklitschli » Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:06 pm

Achilles wrote:Bashing Lewandowski for his reaction after Kimmich goal is getting us closer to paranoia. Completely nonsense.
The game was over(home vs Anderlecht,ten man,2-0 winning) and it was a "sure" pass from Kimmich 9 to 10 times the RB would pass, it's an instinct reaction from not getting the certain pass/score and it was a harmless goal, a beautiful one but on the corpse of Anderlecht.


Yeah, I don't get it either.

Not to mention, Kimmich might have not passed to him to not risk an offside, and maybe Lewa was just dissapointed he botched his run or sth. Reaching I know but reading into all those gestures and then making huge conclusions based on it is a bit much.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby America USA » Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:13 pm

@Ziklitschli - I don't think there's any double standard. No one here makes excuses for Robben's selfishness, in fact I want to scream at the screen when Robben tries to do too much by himself! And even if Arjen is a selfish prick, that trait of his must not be imitated by others because it is not a positive thing to try to replicate. And you very conveniently ignored this saying - Two wrongs don't make a right

And to any other questions regarding Robben that you may have, I've got a very nice reply for you below.

aterford wrote:Robben is selfish.

That's fine. We all acknowledge this.

Lewy is acting worse right now.
Let's stop deflecting and saying "what about Robben though???"
This is the Lewandowski thread. We are talking about Lewandowski and his behavior ALONE. Robben's behavior in the past and present has NOTHING to do with how Lewy acts.

If you wanna complain about Robben's antics, take it to the Robben thread. Otherwise, try and keep the issues separate. Lewy's issues are his own.

Bravo aterford! Couldn't have said it better! =D>
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby aterford » Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:19 pm

The thing is that it's not like this is a new thing from Lewandowski either. Let's not talk like suddenly we lost to Hoffenheim and played poor vs Anderlecht and now Lewandowski is acting this way. He has been acting much worse than usual for all of 17/18 thus far (as well as end of 16/17) If you watched any of preseason you saw this - spending most of his time on the pitch complaining to the referees or to his teammates for not getting the ball to him. I like Lewandowski, but if you can't see that he's been acting noticeably different over the past couple of months then no offense but I don't think you're paying attention. For me it seems like he really still just hasn't got over losing out on Torjägerkanone to Auba. I'm not saying sell Lewy or bench him or send him to the reserves, he's not dead to me or anything like that, but it's really quite clear to me that he's unsettled and unhappy with things at present.
FWIW, I don't necessarily disagree with Lewy's comments outright , but the context/timing was poor to me. Like I said - I'm not trying to get rid of the guy - for me, he's our best player right now - but our SD or somebody needs to get him sorted out ASAP before he causes more trouble (and yes - there are other guys who could use a talking to as well, but like I said their issues are their issues and Lewy's issues are Lewy's.)
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby Ziklitschli » Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:36 pm

America USA wrote:@Ziklitschli - I don't think there's any double standard. No one here makes excuses for Robben's selfishness, in fact I want to scream at the screen when Robben tries to do too much by himself! And even if Arjen is a selfish prick, that trait of his must not be imitated by others because it is not a positive thing to try to replicate. And you very conveniently ignored this saying - Two wrongs don't make a right

And to any other questions regarding Robben that you may have, I've got a very nice reply for you below.


I rarely hear that Robben should be sold because of his behaviour, or how he's a bad egg because he ruins a team spirit (clear example Lewy). Hell, to leave poor Arjen alone for a while, Barca keeps a biting lunatic, Real a prototype primadonna, Chelsea a braindead psycho, yet some of you would sell your elite striker because he did... what exactly? Here's a small bit for comparision:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/201 ... hink-does/

Again, back to Arjen (heh), I just don't think his selfishness is necessairly his negative trait. Of course, making him a team player could have benefits but the question is if he would ever get that far or score his decesive goals if he wasn't his own special kind of wonder in his own world.

Anyway, Lewy is openly selfish mainly towards Robben, and it's an obvious consequence of their personalities. It's nothing new and imo there's no topic, and no "Lewy problem". TV drama and that's all.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby Ziklitschli » Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:40 pm

aterford wrote:The thing is that it's not like this is a new thing from Lewandowski either. Let's not talk like suddenly we lost to Hoffenheim and played poor vs Anderlecht and now Lewandowski is acting this way. He has been acting much worse than usual for all of 17/18 thus far (as well as end of 16/17) If you watched any of preseason you saw this - spending most of his time on the pitch complaining to the referees or to his teammates for not getting the ball to him. I like Lewandowski, but if you can't see that he's been acting noticeably different over the past couple of months then no offense but I don't think you're paying attention. For me it seems like he really still just hasn't got over losing out on Torjägerkanone to Auba. I'm not saying sell Lewy or bench him or send him to the reserves, he's not dead to me or anything like that, but it's really quite clear to me that he's unsettled and unhappy with things at present.
FWIW, I don't necessarily disagree with Lewy's comments outright , but the context/timing was poor to me. Like I said - I'm not trying to get rid of the guy - for me, he's our best player right now - but our SD or somebody needs to get him sorted out ASAP before he causes more trouble (and yes - there are other guys who could use a talking to as well, but like I said their issues are their issues and Lewy's issues are Lewy's.)


Yes, he's obviously frustrated with the way we play in general. Put Muller behind him, problem solved, Lewy happy, match won.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby aterford » Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:48 pm

For what it's worth though (I know I'm kinda contradicting myself as this is Robben-related), but I think Robben's behavior has improved a lot. When Robben and Lewandowski first started playing together, yes, it's true, Robben rarely connected well with him and IMO was in the wrong there. But up until a couple months ago Robben and Lewy had been playing together and coexisting just fine. Nobody was worried that Robben was being too selfish with Lewy, we had all forgotten about that ages ago. They had been on seemingly good terms and happy with each other on the pitch for a couple of years now. So while I don't think Robben is wholly without fault, by and large - lately the problem has been with Robert and not so much Arjen.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby IsiahRashad » Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:58 pm

Achilles wrote:Bashing Lewandowski for his reaction after Kimmich goal is getting us closer to paranoia. Completely nonsense.
The game was over(home vs Anderlecht,ten man,2-0 winning) and it was a "sure" pass from Kimmich 9 to 10 times the RB would pass, it's an instinct reaction from not getting the certain pass/score and it was a harmless goal, a beautiful one but on the corpse of Anderlecht.

Lewandowski DOESN'T get the support that other strikers of RM,Barca,Juve or PSG getting, that's mostly due to crap or non-existent offensive tactics(plus Arjen ofc) and bad form of our wingers/midfielders they don't penetrate enough to make ways for the extra pass or the through ball with Lewy being the receiver in other words we don't work as a normal offensive team. I completely understand him in that matter but he over exaggerates sometimes. He is a selfish b4stard but he is a top-3 striker for a long time now, he wouldn't be in that category if he wasn't selfish.

At the moment almost every player looks on the field pretty messed up with no passion, thing is that Lewy got all eyes on him because of his lately unnecessary interview because he is the No.1 star on our team having many fans and of course because of his attitude when he doesn't gets feed properly. Fortunately!!! we're shaping our new world class player, Joshua Kimmich, plays fantastic, scoring & assisting and it's a regular starter.
That's the only positive right now.

*Ribery needs a fine,needs something, we can't tolerate his demands of being a regular and absolute star anymore. He can't.


I agree with the general part of your thoughts Achilles,but saying that Lewy dosn't get the right support is just not right.

For a player known to a be one the of Worlds's most technical strikers combining an eye for goal with a fantastic tactical brain and a poacher's instincts, the fall off in "production" as measured by those stats most often associated with striker productivity.

I will post stats which i find of the 10 of the most efficent strikers in the best 5 leagues in Europe,and after that we're going to take a look at Lewy-s numbers.
(All stats from Squawka and Transfermarkt without penalties).
There is a case to be made for strikers that can convert their chances in the most efficient manner.

10.Olivier Giroud – Arsenal – 19.62%
9.Mauro Icardi – Inter – 19.64%
8.Pierre-Emerick Aubameyang – Dortmund – 19.94%
7.Diego Costa – Chelsea – 20.16%
6.Carlos Bacca – Sevilla and Milan – 20.97%
5.Karim Benzema – Real Madrid – 21.19%
4.Alexandre Lacazette – Lyon – 22.31%
3.Antoine Griezmann – Atletico Madrid – 23.2%
2.Javier Hernandez – Real Madrid and Bayer Leverkusen – 23.61%
1.Luis Suarez – Barcelona – 25.08%

His effectivenes in last season was 17.14% (25 goals from 143 shots) in 15/16 season -18.54% (28 goals from 151 shots) and 15.24% for the 14/15 season (16 goals from 105 shots).

The thing is,Lewy is getting a lot of chances but he's not so scoring enough of them.
This is why i'm getting angry at him sometimes.He's angry that they are not passing to him "sometimes".Well,i would be pissed to if i'm giving you the ball 5 times,but you can't manage to score at least one time.Griezmann is scoring 22 goals in 78 shots.Even Chicharito in 2015/16 scored 16 goals with 63 shots.
It doesn't matter who plays behind you or beside you-when you're playing as a striker,your job is to score efficient and as many goals as possible.
I'm not saying that Lewa is a bad striker.He's not.But,we're going to see a lot,lot different Robert if after Bayern he goes to team that is not going to use him as we're using him.

The last thing that i can say for Lewa at the moment is-you just have to see your own mistakes before pointing the fingers to other people.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby JANCKER » Wed Sep 13, 2017 11:05 pm

He wants to leave and we'll probably sell him. He wants to play for RM but unfortunately for him, Benzema is Perez's and Zidane's pet. I pity him.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby Ziklitschli » Wed Sep 13, 2017 11:21 pm

JANCKER wrote:He wants to leave and we'll probably sell him. He wants to play for RM but unfortunately for him, Benzema is Perez's and Zidane's pet. I pity him.


Maybe. Why didn't he make more fuss in the transfer window then, or leave it for the next one? Making it now on purpose doesn't seem overly pragmatic tbh.
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Re: Robert Lewandowski

Postby Ziklitschli » Wed Sep 13, 2017 11:30 pm

IsiahRashad wrote:The last thing that i can say for Lewa at the moment is-you just have to see your own mistakes before pointing the fingers to other people.


How much space in the box Suarez had though, with defenders busy with Messi and Neymar, or Griezman on a full blown counter, sth we forgot how to do properly. Guardiola tiki taka, Bayern edition was not a good place to be a striker as well, with miliseconds for decision and defenders always in place, neither is the boring leftover of it where Lewa is a lone striker up top. There's also a style of play of a particular striker, opposition, preference etc.

Not saying he's super clinical, just saying that there's a hundred things not dependent on striker ability influencing those stats.
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