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Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby Coman » Wed Nov 23, 2016 2:07 pm

Well like I said the other time. Guardiola has many qualities but many default too :

- his constant desire to make tactical experiments can be great but also not great at all (Lahm, Götze), the best Bayern under Guardiola was the one when he stops this experiments and put an normal line up where every player is at his best position.

- his stubborn desire to play possession football and a defensive very high line

- Most of Bayern players were 100% tired after february every season. He ask too much when it's not really necessary.

All this things are hard to correct, while Ancelotti's problem is easier to correct ... in every team he coached he had the same problem. Fact is he always took 5-6 months to correct it (system, some way to play, some player who start and shouldn't). If the Champions League can be win after 6 months even if you're not that good before ... a championship can't be win if you're not in a good shap more than half of the season. That's maybe why he only one 3 championship in 20 years !
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby PunkCapitalist » Wed Nov 23, 2016 2:54 pm

Dumbledore7 wrote:Bullshit, Kimmich went from 2. Bundesliga to a guaranteed starter in Germany. All because of Pep and has nothing to do with tactics of the team. His tactics and overall management of the squad is questionable, but no question he's by far the best coach in the world. Mourinho, Wenger, Tuchel, Conte are tacticians. Ancelotti, Allegri, Löw, Ferguson are managers. Pep is the truest, most genuine coach.

Very very accurate. We might need at this point to collectively reevaluate our Pep-was-shit stance. He was very good and frankly, I dont think there is anyone better at the moment.

Coman and Jancker also brought balanced PoV.

No coach is perfect, but IMO Pep is the best one out there. I haven't given up on Carlo though, I'm hoping for a big improvement past Jan-Feb. Hope our current adaptation period doesn't cost us much.

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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby RedQueen » Wed Nov 23, 2016 2:58 pm

Dumbledore7 wrote:Bullshit, Kimmich went from 2. Bundesliga to a guaranteed starter in Germany. All because of Pep and has nothing to do with tactics of the team. His tactics and overall management of the squad is questionable, but no question he's by far the best coach in the world. Mourinho, Wenger, Tuchel, Conte are tacticians. Ancelotti, Allegri, Löw, Ferguson are managers. Pep is the truest, most genuine coach.

I think it's a little unfair to suggest that Pep is the only one who developed a talent like Kimmich to the level of a German A-team player. Tuchel developed Weigl in much the same manner, and made Mkhitaryan a whole new player (his stay at United shows how much that had to do with the coach). Tah, Brandt, and lately Henrichs are youngsters who were called up for the A-Team under Schmidt. There's also Bellarabi, who had already been written off as a failure and was on his way to another loan to a 2nd division club. That Kimmich is a guaranteed starter while the others are not (yet) has more to do with the position Kimmich fills in the NT, than with Kimmich being far ahead of them. Then there's Klopp who developed Reus and Götze and Gündogan and Lewandowski. And that's only some Bundesliga coaches who come to mind immediately.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby Dumbledore7 » Wed Nov 23, 2016 3:18 pm

RedQueen wrote:
Dumbledore7 wrote:Bullshit, Kimmich went from 2. Bundesliga to a guaranteed starter in Germany. All because of Pep and has nothing to do with tactics of the team. His tactics and overall management of the squad is questionable, but no question he's by far the best coach in the world. Mourinho, Wenger, Tuchel, Conte are tacticians. Ancelotti, Allegri, Löw, Ferguson are managers. Pep is the truest, most genuine coach.

I think it's a little unfair to suggest that Pep is the only one who developed a talent like Kimmich to the level of a German A-team player. Tuchel developed Weigl in much the same manner, and made Mkhitaryan a whole new player (his stay at United shows how much that had to do with the coach). Tah, Brandt, and lately Henrichs are youngsters who were called up for the A-Team under Schmidt. There's also Bellarabi, who had already been written off as a failure and was on his way to another loan to a 2nd division club. That Kimmich is a guaranteed starter while the others are not (yet) has more to do with the position Kimmich fills in the NT, than with Kimmich being far ahead of them. Then there's Klopp who developed Reus and Götze and Gündogan and Lewandowski. And that's only some Bundesliga coaches who come to mind immediately.

I completely agree, I wasn't claiming that Pep is strictly the only one - was simply making a point as an example against the over-generalisation that top club managers have no hand in the development of players. However my opinion is that Pep is a level above those German coaches, although that's not to discredit them at all.

On another note though, Bellarabi is effing rubbish. Ew.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Wed Nov 23, 2016 4:07 pm

Dumbledore7 wrote:Not relevant. JANCKER was saying managers get ready-made products. True to an extent, but Pep is a prime example of one of the very few managers who know how to coach at the top of the world, despite his tactical mistakes.


Well, Pep was also a youth team coach was ;)


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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby Thiagoalcantara » Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:01 pm

You won't know what you lost, until it's gone.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby JANCKER » Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:06 pm

Thiagoalcantara wrote:You won't know what you lost, until it's gone.


Are you leaving somewhere? :P
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby Coman » Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:12 pm

Thiagoalcantara wrote:You won't know what you lost, until it's gone.


You're right. I would never thought Jupp would be miss so much.

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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby Thiagoalcantara » Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:21 pm

Just like Low.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:21 pm

Thiagoalcantara wrote:You won't know what you lost, until it's gone.

13 May 2015:
FCBayernMunchen wrote:Yeah, even winning the double and reaching a CL semi final a year after a treble was poor. Meanwhile, the oh so great HALA MADRID led by the world's best coach Carlo Ancelotti's CL defense season is about to end trophyless. :lol:


5 June 2015:
FCBayernMunchen wrote:I would not be happy with Ancelotti, can't see why he would be any better than Pep.

And a number of other times I spoke about how he's far from the saviour. Admittedly as his appointment got more and more likely I started to believe in him but now I realise that I was (sadly) right when I was unbiased...
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby Thiagoalcantara » Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:32 pm

Only a few of were Pro Pep.

Some were blinded by their hate for Pep and his Spanish players...

Carlo is fantastic ego manager, hence, why Real was an ideal situation for him
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby JANCKER » Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:36 pm

Stop it, you Carlo haters. :P
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby Dumbledore7 » Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:38 pm

JANCKER wrote:Stop it, you Carlo haters. :P


The correct term is "Pep zombies" :P
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby aterford » Thu Nov 24, 2016 2:58 am

I understand a number of the complaints about Pep....One of the ones I heard the most was that he tinkered with things too much, tried to fix things that weren't broken, invented solutions that were looking for problems...

However, I'd welcome some tinkering at the moment. If something went wrong, Pep was always ready to make a change--for better or for worse. Sometimes it worked out well, other times we fell flat on our faces and it was embarrassing--but at least he was willing to try to change something.

Now it feels like the opposite is true. With Carlo if things aren't going our way it just feels like repeatedly bashing our heads against the wall hoping for a breakthrough. I would be happy if Carlo tinkered with things more.

Also, Kimmich is a good point. I don't think Kimmich would progress nearly as well under many other managers. And honestly, we saw improvements pretty much across the world. Boateng wasn't even in the conversation for "World's best CB" before Pep. Alaba, Müller, Lewandowski, Lahm, etc all made some pretty big strides under Pep.
Interestingly, now, under Ancelotti, rotational players like Bernat and Rafinha have been doing wonderfully, while previously untouchable guaranteed-starters like Müller, Boateng, Alaba, Lahm, etc are finding themselves in pretty noticeable slumps...
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby tflags » Thu Nov 24, 2016 11:30 am

RedQueen wrote:I think it's a little unfair to suggest that Pep is the only one who developed a talent like Kimmich to the level of a German A-team player.


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