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Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby MoFattal » Sat Jan 02, 2016 6:34 pm

For me, this statement is justified. Sporting-wise, it might not be much relevant, but it definitely is when it comes to the record books. His benchmark now is Jupp's final half-season. He has to equal that, or it his tenure here will be considered a failure - well, maybe not as a failure, but also not as a success.

On a personal note, I'm still disappointed about his departure as I feel that there is still more potential to achieve with the current team. Both Pep and the players could have benefited from a couple years more. Plus, I don't like the idea of moving back to a more "traditional" game style after watching Pep's beatiful craziness over the past three seasons. Still, Ancelotti should be experienced enough to not go for a drastic, albeit inevitable in my opinion, change in style early on.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby bastos80 » Sat Jan 02, 2016 8:52 pm

Only black & white on this forum... :roll: Guess BILD is the right news source for most people.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby pyrasur » Sat Jan 02, 2016 9:35 pm

I don't view it as a failure not to win the Champions League in a year. However, looking at a time frame of three years, I think even Pep will agree his goal was to bring in the CL at least once during that time. He revolutionized out play, but missing out on CL would be a disappointment.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby bastos80 » Sat Jan 02, 2016 9:42 pm

pyrasur wrote:I don't view it as a failure not to win the Champions League in a year. However, looking at a time frame of three years, I think even Pep will agree his goal was to bring in the CL at least once during that time. He revolutionized out play, but missing out on CL would be a disappointment.


There is a difference between failure and disappointment.
Let's say he wins 3 Bundesliga titles and 2 cups while revolutionizing our play, like you say. Hardly a failure.
That would be just populist bullshit.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby pyrasur » Sat Jan 02, 2016 9:45 pm

So they sensationalize a bit for headlines. Who cares.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby bastos80 » Sat Jan 02, 2016 9:48 pm

pyrasur wrote:So they sensationalize a bit for headlines. Who cares.



I do when it is posted here in a simple tweet to start a discussion ;)
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Sat Jan 02, 2016 10:30 pm

MoFattal wrote:He has to equal that, or it his tenure here will be considered a failure - well, maybe not as a failure, but also not as a success.

I don't see why it's not a success. Merely not as successful as Jupp's.

Of course I'm assuming we're going to win domestic trophies. If we don't, I'd be the first to say we failed this season.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby tflags » Sat Jan 02, 2016 10:46 pm

I'm with Mo on this one as well. He simply wasn't hired to stay locally. Even skipping the occasional salad bowl was quite acceptable but a big ears was written all over his 12 million paycheck. Give or take a few zeros. Comments by the board support this.

Coming Ancelotti, I fear the board tends more towards a 'maybe we will win it' but he's the best around other than the current coach.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby quaazi » Sat Jan 02, 2016 11:57 pm

tflags wrote:But even back then they had Hesse covering German football history before signing Honigstein and that other dude covering Dortmund. (Hesse is a confessed Dortmund follower btw.)

In all fairness, as you said, he is out and open about it and it doesn't seep into his writing at all. At least not in an overbearing way. I for one love Uli Hesse's articles.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby tflags » Sun Jan 03, 2016 4:11 am

Fair enough. For me I don't find his articles particularly appealing though because he rarely -if ever- covers 'this just in' topics but the guy is certainly a walking encyclopedia of German football. Then again he has certainly raised a few flags when the topics merited. I remember his coverage of the free reign on second teams for example at a time none gave the subject its due attention; not even German media.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby RAJBAYERN » Sun Jan 03, 2016 6:20 am

bastos80 wrote:
pyrasur wrote:I don't view it as a failure not to win the Champions League in a year. However, looking at a time frame of three years, I think even Pep will agree his goal was to bring in the CL at least once during that time. He revolutionized out play, but missing out on CL would be a disappointment.


There is a difference between failure and disappointment.

Let's say he wins 3 Bundesliga titles and 2 cups while revolutionizing our play, like you say. Hardly a failure.
That would be just populist bullshit.


But we can use both words, failure in Pep process and disappointment in our memories.

Pep salary says everything. The board spends 51 millions of euros in Pep for make Bayern the best in Europe, will be a failure if he doesn’t fulfill the major goal. Surprisingly, after the board agree with Pep and before his coming, Heynckes achieved the ultimate goal that Hoeness and Rummenigge were looking in their management…

If is enough with the league and cup, then bring back Magath, because is nonsense and stupid to invest tens of millions in coaches for just secure the domestic cups.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby MUTU » Sun Jan 03, 2016 9:19 am

bastos80 wrote:
pyrasur wrote:I don't view it as a failure not to win the Champions League in a year. However, looking at a time frame of three years, I think even Pep will agree his goal was to bring in the CL at least once during that time. He revolutionized out play, but missing out on CL would be a disappointment.


There is a difference between failure and disappointment.
Let's say he wins 3 Bundesliga titles and 2 cups while revolutionizing our play, like you say. Hardly a failure.
That would be just populist bullshit.

You forget most of us are foreign fans who tend to value the Champions League more than German fans and the domestic competitions far less. It's different when you're German because everybody around you cares about the Bundesliga, but it's not the same outside Germany. Therefore most foreign fans don't value the Bundesliga anywhere close to the German fans.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby Dumbledore7 » Sun Jan 03, 2016 9:56 am

MUTU wrote:
bastos80 wrote:
pyrasur wrote:I don't view it as a failure not to win the Champions League in a year. However, looking at a time frame of three years, I think even Pep will agree his goal was to bring in the CL at least once during that time. He revolutionized out play, but missing out on CL would be a disappointment.


There is a difference between failure and disappointment.
Let's say he wins 3 Bundesliga titles and 2 cups while revolutionizing our play, like you say. Hardly a failure.
That would be just populist bullshit.

You forget most of us are foreign fans who tend to value the Champions League more than German fans and the domestic competitions far less. It's different when you're German because everybody around you cares about the Bundesliga, but it's not the same outside Germany. Therefore most foreign fans don't value the Bundesliga anywhere close to the German fans.


As a foreigh fan, and this is just my one personal opinion, I disagree. I very much prefer a German monopoly to a couple more big-eared trophy. If we don't win in Europe but achieve an acceptable finish (meaning at least top 4), I can perfectly live with the statement "This season, Barcelona is the strongest team in Europe, with Bayern in 2nd or 3rd best". If we don't win the Bundesliga, then it will be "Bayern aren't even the best team in Germany, Dortmund are" - I'll lose sleep with that sentence playing over and over in my head.

I know you're probably thinking about the people around you in real life, who would support an international variety of clubs, so they would only pay attention to Bayern only through Champions League, but personally I'm okay. Being in England, after we won it at Wembley, there's some degree of respect here even though sometimes people think I'm plastic :mrgreen:

That being said I'm probably in the vast minority. When I started supporting (recently, compared to many of you. I've never tasted your '99 despair or the '01 nailbiting victory) it was in 2002 onwards when we couldn't seem to target the CL trophy as we do now and Europe was a bonus for me, so maybe that modesty still holds today.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby ramsej84 » Sun Jan 03, 2016 10:21 am

All my friends who support other teams from Ita and Eng always with the cliche that we play on our own in the BuLi.
Obv I counter that with many arguments.
As for what MUTU said I used to disagree cause we had a modest team compared to the one we started building in the last five yrs.
So now yes I would prefer a 3rd place in the BuLi with another European triumph or two. Having said that to win a comp such as the champs league one needs a lot of luck as well... And if a team can set an objective to conquest the league one cannot do the same for the champs league. So that is in defense of the coach.
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Re: Pep Guardiola [Josep Guardiola i Sala]

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Sun Jan 03, 2016 12:31 pm

ramsej84 wrote:All my friends who support other teams from Ita and Eng always with the cliche that we play on our own in the BuLi.
Obv I counter that with many arguments.
As for what MUTU said I used to disagree cause we had a modest team compared to the one we started building in the last five yrs.
So now yes I would prefer a 3rd place in the BuLi with another European triumph or two. Having said that to win a comp such as the champs league one needs a lot of luck as well... And if a team can set an objective to conquest the league one cannot do the same for the champs league. So that is in defense of the coach.

Agreed 100%. And like you, on the whole I too used to consider the league to be more important but because of our strength right now would rather win the CL instead. But my benchmark for success remains the Bundesliga. As long as a season delivers at least the Bundesliga (or if it doesn't, the Champions League), then it's a success to me.
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