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Today in History

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Re: Today in History

Postby ottackon » Tue Mar 08, 2016 12:49 pm

The European Union was largely an American project

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... hiefs.html
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Re: Today in History

Postby #12 » Tue Mar 08, 2016 12:52 pm

And it brought peace and prosperity to the continent...
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Re: Today in History

Postby ottackon » Tue Mar 08, 2016 12:53 pm

It's the Disneyland point of view where everything is nice and lovely.
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Re: Today in History

Postby ramsej84 » Tue Mar 08, 2016 1:02 pm

HUH the ttip... all countries (pro american) are in favour... how that is good for us? - My preferred scenario is a reformed europe without liberals around...

Huh the refugees... when we and italy were being invaded with thousands of thousands and after all those poor ppl who drowned in the Med sea... all for nothing just to arrive in a debt stricken continent...
I still remember Barroso and that swedish witch Malltrom shedding crocodile tears... and did nothing...
HOWEVER When the prob came at your doorstep Northern european countries started to panic... but only when it did come to you...
And don' t bee fooled ... Germany acted because it did want africans ... syrians and iraqis ok... double standards... and we all know why you picked and choose..
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Re: Today in History

Postby JANKER » Tue Mar 08, 2016 4:50 pm

The EU will collapse just like Yugoslavia and SSSR. When will we learn from history?
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Re: Today in History

Postby #12 » Tue Mar 08, 2016 6:25 pm

TTIP also lets "us" set standards in research and other areas... It's still bad, but not in all entirety...

And that Europe with "no liberals" - what do you think you will gain? With all due respect, Malta is nowhere near the spheres of economic power that grant you your current standard of living... ;)
And "we" are not picking... We have a constitution... ;)

ottackon wrote:It's the Disneyland point of view where everything is nice and lovely.


No one said that... But we had TWO wars here that led the entire world on the brink of catastrophy... I think we're better off now... ;)
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Re: Today in History

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Tue Mar 08, 2016 7:17 pm

The only thing I detest about the EU is the anti-democratic actions it sometimes takes... pushing in regulations against the people's will etc. I also feel that the parliament is fundamentally flawed. Malta, for example, only has 6 (?) MEPs. It makes sense to base the number of MPs on the size of a region in a country, but in a union of countries that means that any decision will mostly be made by other countries and our say is almost insignificant, but we will be obliged to abide. Of course the European Council is more important and we have equal say there, but you get my point.

These are things that can easily be reformed, I think.
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Re: Today in History

Postby ramsej84 » Tue Mar 08, 2016 8:10 pm

#12 wrote:TTIP also lets "us" set standards in research and other areas... It's still bad, but not in all entirety...

And that Europe with "no liberals" - what do you think you will gain? With all due respect, Malta is nowhere near the spheres of economic power that grant you your current standard of living... ;)
And "we" are not picking... We have a constitution... ;)

ottackon wrote:It's the Disneyland point of view where everything is nice and lovely.


No one said that... But we had TWO wars here that led the entire world on the brink of catastrophy... I think we're better off now... ;)

How many sub saharan migrants did you took...? and answer my question if you will...
your country only reacted when migrants started to enter through your gates... Before no one wanted to move a finger... you were using us and italy as your garbage...
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Re: Today in History

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Tue Mar 08, 2016 8:28 pm

ramsej84 wrote:your country only reacted when migrants started to enter through your gates... Before no one wanted to move a finger... you were using us and italy as your garbage...

Saying we're their garbage is taking it too far, but it's true that Italy and Malta have been facing a migrant crisis of sorts for years and were left to fend on their own. The migrant sharing system devised in 2015 was something we'd been calling for for years. Unfortunately, I think this ties in to what I said about the current parliamentary system being fit for a country but not a union of countries.
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Re: Today in History

Postby #12 » Tue Mar 08, 2016 8:48 pm

FCBayernMunchen wrote:The only thing I detest about the EU is the anti-democratic actions it sometimes takes... pushing in regulations against the people's will etc. I also feel that the parliament is fundamentally flawed. Malta, for example, only has 6 (?) MEPs. It makes sense to base the number of MPs on the size of a region in a country, but in a union of countries that means that any decision will mostly be made by other countries and our say is almost insignificant, but we will be obliged to abide. Of course the European Council is more important and we have equal say there, but you get my point.

These are things that can easily be reformed, I think.


True... But AFAIK this doesn't go too far, just general trade/economy regulations right? Or can you give an example where it concerned you in a negative way?

ramsej84 wrote:How many sub saharan migrants did you took...? and answer my question if you will...
your country only reacted when migrants started to enter through your gates... Before no one wanted to move a finger... you were using us and italy as your garbage...


We're not taking any migrants - we're taking refugees - any that come from a non-safe country of origin...

You're right about the fact that you bore the brunt for years - which said lady you criticize now recognized and argued for as one of the first... ;)
And in fact that's one of the main reasons she brings forth every time people HERE ask here why she did it... Actually, I think she's one of the few that also thinks about smaller countries...
And no one is entering through our gates - we don't have any gates... Only people whose asylum request has been granted actually get any money and shelter here...

But since this is not about the migrant crisis, honestly: you said it yourself: you're overcrowded - which I cannot argue for or against, because I've never been there... But the population/square kilometer ratio wikipedia gives seems very high... So - do you think you have enough land to grow your crops? Grow your meat? Enough oil to fuel your cars? enough resources to build your phones and computers? and do you really think this sort of stuff would get cheaper, with frontiers reinstated? That you would get the same amount of stuff for a comparable price, with a weaker currency? I seriously doubt that...
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Re: Today in History

Postby German-American » Tue Mar 08, 2016 8:56 pm

ramsej84 wrote:HUH the ttip... all countries (pro american) are in favour... how that is good for us? - My preferred scenario is a reformed europe without liberals around...

Huh the refugees... when we and italy were being invaded with thousands of thousands and after all those poor ppl who drowned in the Med sea... all for nothing just to arrive in a debt stricken continent...
I still remember Barroso and that swedish witch Malltrom shedding crocodile tears... and did nothing...
HOWEVER When the prob came at your doorstep Northern european countries started to panic... but only when it did come to you...
And don' t bee fooled ... Germany acted because it did want africans ... syrians and iraqis ok... double standards... and we all know why you picked and choose..

I would like that to, but it probably won't happen until some huge world event happens(like another world war) because the mass amount of people will need to see that socialism/liberalism is not going to work in the long run.
As government progresses it always becomes more corrupted, always(until its reformed).

When something a major event does happen people will be sick of government and want less interaction with it, only a matter of question of whether the officials will listen to the people.

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Re: Today in History

Postby JANKER » Tue Mar 08, 2016 8:58 pm

#12 wrote:weaker currency


That's a myth... I miss the Deutsche Mark and especially the Hundert Mark but not our Hundertmark player, this coming from someone outside Germany.
Compare what you could buy with one DM and what you can buy with one Euro...?
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Re: Today in History

Postby #12 » Tue Mar 08, 2016 9:00 pm

The Deutsche Mark was a somewhat stronger currency - albeit worth less and looking better... ;) :P
But it's a known fact, that spending capacity per capita has increased massively...
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Re: Today in History

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Tue Mar 08, 2016 9:05 pm

#12 wrote:True... But AFAIK this doesn't go too far, just general trade/economy regulations right? Or can you give an example where it concerned you in a negative way?

I can't give an example because I'm not that well-versed about the topic. It's more the general principle of it. Progress has been made, though, in the way the president of the Commission was elected last time around, for example.

Farage and UKIP a few years ago used to mention how the EU completely ignored the outcomes of referendums in France, the Netherlands, and Ireland. I'm not sure how accurate this is or whether they were blowing it out of proportion, but the fact that accusations like that are possible is worrying.
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Re: Today in History

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Tue Mar 08, 2016 9:10 pm

#12 wrote:That you would get the same amount of stuff for a comparable price, with a weaker currency?

Although I agree with much of what you say (although no country can survive without others. But the EU certainly eases trade), I have to point out that the Maltese lira was a very strong currency.
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