FC Bayern Forum

MatchBot · by **MatchBot** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 7:15 pm

Competition: UEFA EURO 2016
Venue: Parc des Princes, Paris (neutral venue)
Kick off:

Lukas · by **Lukas** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 9:00 pm

Just realised Germany should play either Spain or Italy in the qf. So might as well lose this and go out now rather than put us through a load of shit for nothing.

ramsej84 · by **ramsej84** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 9:14 pm

Lukas wrote:Just realised Germany should play either Spain or Italy in the qf. So might as well lose this and go out now rather than put us through a load of shit for nothing.

Amen

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Jorge · by **Jorge** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 9:52 pm

The big question that I have is how Joachim Löw managed to turn the fast paced attacking German team from 2010-11 into a slow tempo-possession based team able to make 80,000 people yawn at the same time? During the game vs Poland I needed 3 shots of intravenous caffeine to be able to watch 90 minutes. What would it take, to bench some of the experienced players and give guys like Sane and Kimmich a chance?

KrampusIsReal · by **KrampusIsReal** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:15 pm

This has the USA game feeling to it from the world cup...

Like to see Muller put on point, either play kross or ozil not both to start.

ramsej84 · by **ramsej84** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:37 pm

because Loew likes to copy cat Pep Guardiola...
Two summers ago he liked the idea of wasting the best RB in the world in midfield...
He also became obsessed with the false 9...
Now it is the possession...

However besides all the above the thing that will make Germany flop in this tournament as I have been saying since early 2016 is : they lack passion and the motivation needed to take a team to the final.
This might be because of the fact that the coach has been there for too long...
I know that Loew has a contract till 2018 but I just hope that if he does not make it to the semis (which he won't) his contract will be terminated.

Jorge · by **Jorge** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 4:40 am

ramsej84 wrote:because Loew likes to copy cat Pep Guardiola...
Two summers ago he liked the idea of wasting the best RB in the world in midfield...
He also became obsessed with the false 9...
Now it is the possession...

However besides all the above the thing that will make Germany flop in this tournament as I have been saying since early 2016 is : they lack passion and the motivation needed to take a team to the final.
This might be because of the fact that the coach has been there for too long...
I know that Loew has a contract till 2018 but I just hope that if he does not make it to the semis (which he won't) his contract will be terminated.

You brought up a good point: this 2016 Germany still shows signs of the WC win hangover; but is the length of the coach with the team or Löw's persona? Germany is a world example on what stability at National Level can do for a country. In the history of the Mannschaft there has been only 10 coaches. Helmut Schön had been in charge of the team 10 years when he won the World Cup in 74 two years after winning the Euros, then had another good run in Euro 1976. True, by 1978 it was too much and time to go, but Derwall, Beckenbauer and Vogts had longs spells as well.

Even in times of turmoil Germany remained calm, like in the period from the late 90's until the arrival of Löw, as a reference Mexico from 1990 to 2010 had 17 coaches, almost one per year; so it is hard to make a case against Löw solely based on the time he has been in charge. It is more about his personality, his tendency to stay in the comfort zone and not elevating the younger players to challenge the status of the established players, this makes the team look predictable and complacent, it lacks the spark of let's say Germany 2006 when Lahm, Schweinsteiger, Podolski, Huth, Odonkor, Mertesacker, Jansen, were promoted and given the chance to challenge the older players, this made Germany much better and added flare and energy to the team in times of dire needs, this is not the case anymore; the younger players that can spark the team when it goes in the low tempo are staying on the bench, and it is not about fielding 3 or 4 youngsters, it is about introducing at least one per game as a sub or as a surprise starter in lieu of some who are not performing well and see what impact it has.

BTW, unless he turns this team around on a dime I do not see Germany going too far and hopefully he is replaced by somebody with a different approach for the 2018 cycle. I do not want to see Podolski still warming the bench at 33 years of age in Russia.

ramsej84 · by **ramsej84** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 7:09 am

In your op who do you think can take over from JL?
I used to say Klopp but imo that is impossible now ...at least till 2018.
Maybe the guy at RB Leipzig? Or maybe Tuchel as a part time (staying at BVB)

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DerKaiser · by **DerKaiser** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 7:38 am

ramsej84 wrote:In your op who do you think can take over from JL?
I used to say Klopp but imo that is impossible now ...at least till 2018.
Maybe the guy at RB Leipzig? Or maybe Tuchel as a part time (staying at BVB)

Mehmet Scholl, Thomas Schaaf, Holger Stanislawski

FCBayernMunchen · by **FCBayernMunchen** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 8:57 am

Jorge wrote:The big question that I have is how Joachim Löw managed to turn the fast paced attacking German team from 2010-11 into a slow tempo-possession based team able to make 80,000 people yawn at the same time? During the game vs Poland I needed 3 shots of intravenous caffeine to be able to watch 90 minutes. What would it take, to bench some of the experienced players and give guys like Sane and Kimmich a chance?

This is going to sound harsh considering I'm talking about a world cup winning coach, but do you seriously think Loew ever did anything?

In 2010, following an excellent season by Bayern in which we adopted a new style of play, Germany did the same thing. Some of the key players were Schweinsteiger in his new position as CM and Muller on RW. When Lahm started playing RB for Germany, Loew put him there too.
In 2012, although we did not win anything, we had a good season especially in the CL. Loew followed suit, for instance by starting Gomez over Klose.
In 2014, again Bayern had a different style which Loew adopted. He tried Lahm at CM. CBs at fullback. And after that (or even before?) Gotze in the striker position.

Now Germany have less Bayern players than ever and he is clueless. It sounds a bit big-headed, but I do not think that the lack of Bayern players and the below average performances Germany have had since 2014 are unrelated.

ramsej84 · by **ramsej84** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:10 am

that is I think that someone who is now gone came for a mission... to destroy German football.

FCBayernMunchen · by **FCBayernMunchen** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:18 am

ramsej84 wrote:that is I think that someone who is now gone came for a mission... to destroy German football.

Nah, I see it differently (obviously

). It is not an easy style to implement. Bayern improved gradually over 3 years in it. I think Germany simply don't have the players to play that way, unlike Bayern. This is where I blame Loew. Like I said, once there are no longer enough Bayern players and the others cannot replicate the Bayern system, he is clueless and has no idea how to make it better.

Also, I'm going out on a limb and predicting that if Germany do meet Italy in the QFs, the game will go to penalties and could very well end up being Germany's first even win over them.

quaazi · by **quaazi** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:36 am

The Bundesjogi is a fool, and one that's benefitted enormously from the development of German football in the club level. Unfortunately, and whisper it, but at the moment, the German squad just maybe isn't good enough.

JANCKER · by **JANCKER** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:56 am

It's normal for national team SELECTORS to benefit from club level improvements... as they are not really TRAINERS, their main duty is to pick... they don't have time to invent anything, just to pick the players and a playing style... they can't train or implement something big of their own in a matter of 10 days. And when I say pick... I don't mean nose.