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[2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Discussions on international matches played by Germany's senior national team and youth teams.
 

What is your prediction for this match?

Poll ended at Tue Jun 21, 2016 5:00 pm

Northern Ireland will win
2
22%
It will end in a draw
1
11%
Germany will win
6
67%
 
Total votes : 9

Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby Machiavellico » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:49 pm

Too many of you are overreacting. I highly doubt that you were euphoric after the first three matches of the World Cup. I sure as hell wasn't. Yes, Löw has his share of mistakes and yes, many things that concern the style of play depend on Bayern's, but he's doing his best to manage this situation.
No one likes Götze playing up front. I don't either. But who would you rather he start there? Gomez? He's nowhere near what he used to be. Right now he's dropped to a Gladbach level. Müller? Yes, he can play as a striker, but every Bayern fan is aware of the fact that that position is not at what he excels. So his hands are pretty tied regarding the CF position.
Not much has changed for this side since 2014. Lahm and Schweinsteiger are the two major losses that have occured. You can't replace Lahm. And there is no young RB he could try to force into the team. Not that he would, but he couldn't. Schweinsteiger? Germany, currently, has no midfielder that could do what Schweinsteiger did. Run, dribble, tackle, shoot and pass. Both Weigl and Kimmich are defensive minded. They wouldn't change the apparent lack of creativity that takes place up front. And he's had some bad luck with that too. Reus getting injured for both WC 2014 and this? Gündogan as well? Woulds and shoulds, yeah, but it might've been a bit better with them.
I think the only major thing one could blame Löw for is not playing Sané or leaving Brandt at home in favor of Podolski or Schürrle.
A team's worth is not seen against the small teams. Too much negativism around here. It's like judging Bayern just after the matches against teams like Ingolstadt, Braunschweig or Darmstadt.
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby PunkCapitalist » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:53 pm

Fgs, Sandro Wagner would do a better job at striker than Götze. Anything is better than Götze there.

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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby JANCKER » Sat Jun 18, 2016 10:04 pm

Play Schuerrle or Sane over Goetze and let Mueller take the striker slot.
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby RB624 » Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:10 pm

Lukas wrote:Just realised Germany should play either Spain or Italy in the qf. So might as well lose this and go out now rather than put us through a load of shit for nothing.


If Germany wins their group, they cannot play Italy until the semi-final. If Germany are group runners-up, they could meet Spain in the quarters.

(Edit: Lukas was right. I corrected myself in a later post.)
Last edited by RB624 on Sun Jun 19, 2016 12:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby Lukas » Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:12 pm

Sorry I just don't think this team has it in them to scrape through as you describe. Goes back to the lack of character issue again. By all means you can win by playing badly (the mark of champions so they say) but you need a certain spirit and character in the team to do this
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby Lukas » Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:24 pm

RB624 wrote:
Lukas wrote:Just realised Germany should play either Spain or Italy in the qf. So might as well lose this and go out now rather than put us through a load of shit for nothing.


If Germany wins their group, they cannot play Italy until the semi-final. If Germany are group runners-up, they could meet Spain in the quarters.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/eur ... kout-stage
According to this the winner of C1 (possibly Germany)) v 3ABF will play the winner of E1 (probably Italy) v D2 in the QF stage
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby RB624 » Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:27 pm

Lukas wrote:
RB624 wrote:
Lukas wrote:Just realised Germany should play either Spain or Italy in the qf. So might as well lose this and go out now rather than put us through a load of shit for nothing.


If Germany wins their group, they cannot play Italy until the semi-final. If Germany are group runners-up, they could meet Spain in the quarters.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/eur ... kout-stage
According to this the winner of C1 (possibly Germany)) v 3ABF will play the winner of E1 (probably Italy) v D2 in the QF stage


Yup, I totally mixed up A and C somehow. Sorry :(
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby RB624 » Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:29 pm

Lukas wrote:Sorry I just don't think this team has it in them to scrape through as you describe. Goes back to the lack of character issue again. By all means you can win by playing badly (the mark of champions so they say) but you need a certain spirit and character in the team to do this


If I had any faith in Low, I'd say you might be wrong. But alas, I have no faith in him to make tactical decisions nor to motivate.
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Sun Jun 19, 2016 11:49 am

Machiavellico wrote:Too many of you are overreacting. I highly doubt that you were euphoric after the first three matches of the World Cup. I sure as hell wasn't. Yes, Löw has his share of mistakes and yes, many things that concern the style of play depend on Bayern's, but he's doing his best to manage this situation.

The thing is, in the world cup he was helped by Mustafi's injury. I am 99% sure Germany wouldn't have won the WC if that hadn't happened because Loew would not have made the necessary changes like he would not have called played Neuer and Muller in 2010 if it weren't for injuries.

In 2014, there was also Neuer to bail out the rest of the team vs Algeria, like Boateng and Neuer have been doing in this tournament so far.

I have no doubt that he's doing his best, but his best is probably not good enough.

Machiavellico wrote:No one likes Götze playing up front. I don't either. But who would you rather he start there? Gomez? He's nowhere near what he used to be. Right now he's dropped to a Gladbach level. Müller? Yes, he can play as a striker, but every Bayern fan is aware of the fact that that position is not at what he excels. So his hands are pretty tied regarding the CF position.

I have not been following Gomez closely, but I believe he was playing quite well. He didn't do anything in his 20 minutes vs Poland, but he is worth another shot because we know he can be good. That is everything for me. Gotze there simply makes no sense because he has never had a performance to write home about in that position. I agree that Muller isn't effective in that position, but he will 100% be more dangerous than Gotze. Even Schurrle or Sane are preferable options there than Gotze. Heck, at this point I would even rather see Ozil. I think he'd fail just as much as Gotze, but for all we know he might suceed as a false 9. We know Gotze won't.

Machiavellico wrote:Not much has changed for this side since 2014. Lahm and Schweinsteiger are the two major losses that have occured. You can't replace Lahm. And there is no young RB he could try to force into the team. Not that he would, but he couldn't. Schweinsteiger? Germany, currently, has no midfielder that could do what Schweinsteiger did. Run, dribble, tackle, shoot and pass. Both Weigl and Kimmich are defensive minded. They wouldn't change the apparent lack of creativity that takes place up front. And he's had some bad luck with that too. Reus getting injured for both WC 2014 and this? Gündogan as well? Woulds and shoulds, yeah, but it might've been a bit better with them.

Well, I think the midfield isn't a problem, so credit there. I don't think there's a need for any changes in those 2 positions, although once Schweinsteiger is fully fit it would be nice to see him there. Howedes, unless he improves and plays like at the WC, will be a problem against the bigger teams. Like you said, the problem is that there is no obvious alternative, but now is the time to try and find a solution. We were worried when our CBs got injured in January, but putting Kimmich there unexpectedly solved our worries. He might do the same thing for Loew, but he has to play against a team like N. Ireland rather than be thrown into the pitch vs Spain or someone.

A team's worth is not judged against small teams, but the thing is this has been a problem since Germany won the WC. They have had consistently bad performances, and while it's true that Germany never do well in friendlies, the qualifying campaign was below average as well.
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby DerKaiser » Sun Jun 19, 2016 12:01 pm




you think these are some kind of carnival teams
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby RB624 » Sun Jun 19, 2016 12:59 pm

Alright, I have to redeem myself after getting the brackets mixed up. How's this for a possible scenario:

Croatia beats Spain to top group leading to a round of 16 between Spain and Italy.
Germany draws with N.Ireland, and Poland beats Ukraine.
Germany finishes as group runners-up and avoids Spain, Italy and FRANCE until Final.

I think we all have to support N.Ireland to scrap and get a draw and Poland and Croatia to win.

There is still hope for Germany! (unless I've misread things again :( )
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby ramsej84 » Sun Jun 19, 2016 3:25 pm

RB624 wrote:Alright, I have to redeem myself after getting the brackets mixed up. How's this for a possible scenario:

Croatia beats Spain to top group leading to a round of 16 between Spain and Italy.
Germany draws with N.Ireland, and Poland beats Ukraine.
Germany finishes as group runners-up and avoids Spain, Italy and FRANCE until Final.

I think we all have to support N.Ireland to scrap and get a draw and Poland and Croatia to win.

There is still hope for Germany! (unless I've misread things again :( )

But italy can face Cro ... A tm that always gives them hard time.
I am only positive when Ita is out otherwise Germany have 0 chances.

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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby RB624 » Sun Jun 19, 2016 3:33 pm

ramsej84 wrote:
RB624 wrote:Alright, I have to redeem myself after getting the brackets mixed up. How's this for a possible scenario:

Croatia beats Spain to top group leading to a round of 16 between Spain and Italy.
Germany draws with N.Ireland, and Poland beats Ukraine.
Germany finishes as group runners-up and avoids Spain, Italy and FRANCE until Final.

I think we all have to support N.Ireland to scrap and get a draw and Poland and Croatia to win.

There is still hope for Germany! (unless I've misread things again :( )

But italy can face Cro ... A tm that always gives them hard time.
I am only positive when Ita is out otherwise Germany have 0 chances.

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Yes, but by finishing second in their group, Germany will avoid Italy AND France until the final, AND they will also avoid Spain if Croatia wins. The question would then be whether Germany could beat Croatia, who they'd face in the quarters if both won their round of 16.
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Sun Jun 19, 2016 3:44 pm

RB624 wrote:Alright, I have to redeem myself after getting the brackets mixed up. How's this for a possible scenario:

Croatia beats Spain to top group leading to a round of 16 between Spain and Italy.
Germany draws with N.Ireland, and Poland beats Ukraine.
Germany finishes as group runners-up and avoids Spain, Italy and FRANCE until Final.

I think we all have to support N.Ireland to scrap and get a draw and Poland and Croatia to win.

There is still hope for Germany! (unless I've misread things again :( )

With a draw, Northern Ireland would almost certainly qualify as well as one of the best third place teams. Fixed match approaching? :P
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Re: [2016-06-21] Northern Ireland vs Germany

Postby RB624 » Sun Jun 19, 2016 3:49 pm

^ I just don't think Low is smart enough to do it or even think of it.
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