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[2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Discussions on international matches played by Germany's senior national team and youth teams.
 

What is your prediction for this match?

Poll ended at Sun Jun 17, 2012 8:45 pm

Denmark will win
0
No votes
It will end in a draw
0
No votes
Germany will win
11
100%
 
Total votes : 11

Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby MoFattal » Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:05 pm

I didn't see that much wrong in Gomez' performance last night. He didn't score, but he had a magnificent assist (yes, it was an assist because no one can shoot backward in that direction even if he trained a 100x for it!) and I can't recall him breaking up any attacking play like he used to not so long ago. It wasn't his best game, but considering how he used to "sleep" against such opponents, he has definitely gone a long way forward. He did overplay the ball sometimes though, maybe as a result of the morale boost he got from the previous game :P

As for Muller, this guy has superior tactical intelligence. He was everywhere around the pitch. Offense, defense, left, right, middle, everywhere! BUT, with all of his work rate and positioning attributes, he is currently in a huge decision-making slump. He is there at the right place at the right time, but as soon as he gets the ball, he looks lost. He's got a lot of years ahead of him to improve in this area, but for now we need him at least to marginally improve in that area. It is a shame to see all that tactical brilliance tussed away by a simple wrong decision!
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby YlonenXabi » Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:08 pm

Özil had a very good game IMO

And Kroos is just too lazy to play in Khedira's role. Germany always makes the pressure in the opponents half and Khedira runs a lot. I don't think Kroos can do that
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby MUTU » Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:09 pm

AvatarX wrote:
MUTU wrote:Not only were Podolski and Khedira bad, but also Oezil. This guy is simply not living up to his potential and his only purpose seems to slow down our attacks with absolutely useless dribbles rather than inviting through balls like the 2 that Schweinsteiger did against Holland.

I don't think Kroos would do any worse in his position...


Disagree about Oezil. He did better than the last 2 games and seems improving.

Also you "forgot" to mention Gomez to the disappointments of yesterday game.

He was bad and struggled most of the times (because of pressure of defence) and the few times he actually got the ball, he tried to do things that he isn't really capable of. Also he failed to cover Krohn-Dehli in the equalizer.

I got the feeling (hopefully I am wrong) that he thinks he proved himself already. Well, the real tournament has just began (with the knockout phase).

Gomez was disappointing because...? He was double marked all match, which left his teammates with more space or unmarked (eg Mueller and Khedira who both had horrible misses, and Podolski who Gomez assisted to). Seriously, the guy was involved in all four Germany goals while his teammates have been missing chance after chance after chance. And yet you want to shift blame onto him? Europe is watching and laughing at the mistreatment that Gomez gets.
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby YlonenXabi » Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:10 pm

MoFattal wrote:As for Muller, this guy has superior tactical intelligence. He was everywhere around the pitch. Offense, defense, left, right, middle, everywhere! BUT, with all of his work rate and positioning attributes, he is currently in a huge decision-making slump. He is there at the right place at the right time, but as soon as he gets the ball, he looks lost. He's got a lot of years ahead of him to improve in this area, but for now we need him at least to marginally improve in that area. It is a shame to see all that tactical brilliance tussed away by a simple wrong decision!



Agree 100%
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby walter » Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:18 pm

AvatarX wrote:
Hey... a dying tree could be a good opponent:


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


BTW, I watched the game again last night (ESPN3 on the computer) and there is a replay of Podolski's goal that you wont see on a highlights reel because they actually showed it when they substituted Poldi and it shows that Gomez did flick the ball back intentionally. Even in the whole motion of doing it he takes a quick look behind. So, good assist by Gomez, he is doing some weird-ass brazilian shitz this tournament...
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby AvatarX » Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:42 pm

MUTU wrote:
AvatarX wrote:
MUTU wrote:Not only were Podolski and Khedira bad, but also Oezil. This guy is simply not living up to his potential and his only purpose seems to slow down our attacks with absolutely useless dribbles rather than inviting through balls like the 2 that Schweinsteiger did against Holland.

I don't think Kroos would do any worse in his position...


Disagree about Oezil. He did better than the last 2 games and seems improving.

Also you "forgot" to mention Gomez to the disappointments of yesterday game.

He was bad and struggled most of the times (because of pressure of defence) and the few times he actually got the ball, he tried to do things that he isn't really capable of. Also he failed to cover Krohn-Dehli in the equalizer.

I got the feeling (hopefully I am wrong) that he thinks he proved himself already. Well, the real tournament has just began (with the knockout phase).

Gomez was disappointing because...? He was double marked all match, which left his teammates with more space or unmarked (eg Mueller and Khedira who both had horrible misses, and Podolski who Gomez assisted to). Seriously, the guy was involved in all four Germany goals while his teammates have been missing chance after chance after chance. And yet you want to shift blame onto him? Europe is watching and laughing at the mistreatment that Gomez gets.


Gomez was disappointing because he was disappointing. He missed at least two clear chances trying to impersonate Messi or Robben.
Yes, he was double marked, but seriously what did you expect? Or it has to be an "eye-marking defence", like Holland in order for him to score? Well, maybe this is shocking news, but those defences are really hard to find, especially in the knock-out phase.

So let me get something straight. This was a good performance in your opinion? If it was, I wonder how a bad one is.

And of course he was involved in all 4 goals. He is the lone striker waiting in the box for tap ins and every player is trying to pass to him.

Anyway, I hope he plays better in the next game(s) because maybe in your book he is already top of the NT with those 3 goals in the group stage, but those 3 goals would mean nothing if he is invisible or ineffective when it will matter.
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby walter » Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:50 pm

I don't think we need to point at any players, Gomez was not bad, just average like most players this game.
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby frankiecam13 » Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:15 pm

did any body think germany played a dangerous game last nite they could have been 3-1 down at 1 stage i bet if it was spain that penalty would have been given any way its over greece is a certainty its the portugal game that worries me if we get them
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby MUTU » Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:17 pm

@AvatarX: your definition of clear cut chance is really weird. For me there were only 3 clear cut chances: one missed by Mueller, one missed by Khedira and one scored by Podolski. I don't even count Schurrle's chance as clear cut as it was quite angled. Perhaps you watched the match-that-should-not-be-named instead?

Yes, this was a good performance. He drew two defenders and made a world class assist. Even if he didn't, the fact that he consistently drew two defenders towards him meant he gave a valid contribution, and this is discounting the assist, which Podolski did his best to miss (the keeper saved it in fact but it still went in). Truth is that Germany really have him to thank because in attack he looks like the only one capable of scoring.

Also if by your definition a striker sucks if his team doesn't win a competition, does that mean there is only one good striker in Europe every 2 or 4 years? And not a single non-sucking German striker since 1996?
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby AvatarX » Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:28 pm

MUTU wrote:@AvatarX: your definition of clear cut chance is really weird. For me there were only 3 clear cut chances: one missed by Mueller, one missed by Khedira and one scored by Podolski. I don't even count Schurrle's chance as clear cut as it was quite angled. Perhaps you watched the match-that-should-not-be-named instead?


Maybe unconsciously your mind deletes any miss by Gomez :) Anyway, maybe if we count the assist as intended we can say it was an average performance. Problem is that average for the lone striker will not be good enough for the next games.
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby AvatarX » Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:34 pm

MUTU wrote:Also if by your definition a striker sucks if his team doesn't win a competition, does that mean there is only one good striker in Europe every 2 or 4 years? And not a single non-sucking German striker since 1996?


I didn't say that, but you are right in a sense. History hardly writes about strikers in second placed teams.
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby MUTU » Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:34 pm

AvatarX wrote:
MUTU wrote:@AvatarX: your definition of clear cut chance is really weird. For me there were only 3 clear cut chances: one missed by Mueller, one missed by Khedira and one scored by Podolski. I don't even count Schurrle's chance as clear cut as it was quite angled. Perhaps you watched the match-that-should-not-be-named instead?


Maybe unconsciously your mind deletes any miss by Gomez :) Anyway, maybe if we count the assist as intended we can say it was an average performance. Problem is that average for the lone striker will not be good enough for the next games.

Was he one on one against the keeper, in a central position and unchallenged by a defender? Mueller, Khedira and Podolski were. Gomez wasn't. Perhaps you dreamt up some miss and thought it was real? ;P
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby AvatarX » Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:39 pm

MUTU wrote:
AvatarX wrote:
MUTU wrote:@AvatarX: your definition of clear cut chance is really weird. For me there were only 3 clear cut chances: one missed by Mueller, one missed by Khedira and one scored by Podolski. I don't even count Schurrle's chance as clear cut as it was quite angled. Perhaps you watched the match-that-should-not-be-named instead?


Maybe unconsciously your mind deletes any miss by Gomez :) Anyway, maybe if we count the assist as intended we can say it was an average performance. Problem is that average for the lone striker will not be good enough for the next games.

Was he one on one against the keeper, in a central position and unchallenged by a defender? Mueller, Khedira and Podolski were. Gomez wasn't. Perhaps you dreamt up some miss and thought it was real? ;P


Ok, keep up with your selective blindness. I guess you had that condition during CL final too.

Anyway, since you asked, the first one was Gomez in a box, pretty unchallenged and instead of control the ball and shot he tried to make a Robben-style lob. The second was another chance that instead of shooting in the box, he tried to dribble 2-3 defenders and made fool of himself, losing the ball. Maybe it was all Schweini's fault saying all these stuff about Gomez and Brazil :P
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby MUTU » Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:44 pm

And those were clear cut chances? I'm sorry if you expect him to dribble past the three players and then score. But don't call it clear cut. I guess haters will continue to hate him unless he dribbles past three players and scores, three times a match, in every single match he plays in. And I bet that even then, they will say something ridiculous to hate him for like not having celebrated enough, or for his hairstyle, or for scratching his balls, or for not having scored from a shot within his own half
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Re: [2012-06-17] Denmark vs Germany

Postby AvatarX » Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:51 pm

MUTU wrote:And those were clear cut chances? I'm sorry if you expect him to dribble past the three players and then score.


No, I didn't expect him to do that - it's way beyond his capabilities. I just expect him to shot the ball in.

MUTU wrote:I guess haters will continue to hate him unless he dribbles past three players and scores, three times a match, in every single match he plays in. And I bet that even then, they will say something ridiculous to hate him for like not having celebrated enough, or for his hairstyle, or for scratching his balls, or for not having scored from a shot within his own half


Maybe you are right. Then again lovers will always find something to cheer him for, even when he is invisible or wasteful in a big game - even in a final.

There's no point in arguing more. Clearly we are on the opposite field, but I really hope for the sake of NT that if we go through to the final he won't wear the invisibility cloak again.
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