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LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby ramsej84 » Wed Aug 09, 2017 3:29 pm

#12 wrote:
Mavs wrote:
MUTU wrote:German-American, it's ironic you would use the word "persecuted" when it's actually the LGBT community who are on the receiving end in the vast majority of instances. I think not liking the Allianz colours has much to do with the way you interpret the 'stunt' (I hope nobody gets sensitive by this word!): to me it means "hey, there are LGBT around, please show respect". That's all I get as an interpretation.

Let's use another sensitive topic for comparison. There are black people, Africans, who migrate to traditionally-Caucasian countries. Some people don't want them in their country. They're called racists (just like anti-gays are called homophobes). However nobody bats an eyelid when FIFA put slogans like "let's kick racism out of football". It's basically similar to them saying "let's accept gays".


It's only similar if a) the moral dimension is removed and we all universally agree that there is nothing morally wrong about homosexuality (which people don't agree on) and b) if being homosexual is as innate and inherent as the color of someone's skin.

Those are two highly questionable assumptions. So no, it's not the same.


No they're not...

Maybe #2 is, I don't think being homosexual is DNA based either...
This subject is very complex...
I believe that there are two types of homosexuality.
1. Genetical, I know of three families that have more than one child who is gay/lesbian...

2. Psychological. Those who were exposed to a sexual abuse by a pig...
They become traumatized and they will grow to believe that is the only sexual activity which suits them...

If a girl is abused instead ... she may become afraid of all men, so she either will shy away from men for the rest of her life or turn lesbian.

I am not an expert but this is only my opinion...

The second type imo can be helped to overcome their trauma and return to heterosexuality, although if the abuse happened during puberty there is no going back.

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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Wed Aug 09, 2017 3:42 pm

ramsej84 wrote:No, I think it is a natural thing...
Girls play with dolls cause of their maternal instinct ...

On the other hand boys are tough and even the way they play is different; they push, climb, run, make more dangerous stunts etc.

But what about pink/blue for instance?
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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Wed Aug 09, 2017 3:46 pm

#12 wrote:Maybe #2 is, I don't think being homosexual is DNA based either...

I might get some hate for this (not from you, you probably agree), but let's say it's not biological at all. Let's say being gay/bi/trans is 100% a choice (which I don't believe): so what? So what if it's a choice and not biological? Does that mean you can treat them as inferior or discriminate against them?

Having tattoos is a choice, and unfortunately many hold biases against tattooed people, which I disagree with entirely. To me it would be almost the same thing.
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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Wed Aug 09, 2017 3:50 pm

ramsej84 wrote:This subject is very complex...
I believe that there are two types of homosexuality.
1. Genetical, I know of three families that have more than one child who is gay/lesbian...

2. Psychological. Those who were exposed to a sexual abuse by a pig...
They become traumatized and they will grow to believe that is the only sexual activity which suits them...

I agree there are different kinds and probably not all are genetic but some are (I know a family where both children are trans. The chances of that are much smaller than what you mentioned.) Not sure about your second category though. I would say that's more likely to make one afraid of sex in general.

I don't know, I've just never read or heard of an experience similar to what you suggested but I suppose it's a taboo topic so it could be that they keep silent.
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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby MUTU » Wed Aug 09, 2017 3:50 pm

FCBayernMunchen wrote:
ramsej84 wrote:No, I think it is a natural thing...
Girls play with dolls cause of their maternal instinct ...

On the other hand boys are tough and even the way they play is different; they push, climb, run, make more dangerous stunts etc.

But what about pink/blue for instance?

Weird thing about pink and blue is that a while back the colours were inverted: pink was considered masculine while blue was considered feminine. Apparently it was the French who switched them around to what is currently considered the norm of pink for girls and blue for boys.
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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Wed Aug 09, 2017 3:57 pm

MUTU wrote:Weird thing about pink and blue is that a while back the colours were inverted: pink was considered masculine while blue was considered feminine. Apparently it was the French who switched them around to what is currently considered the norm of pink for girls and blue for boys.

I think I've read something about this before but can't recall at the moment.

P.S. Pink is actually one of my favourite colours, in all of its shades but especially light pink. Heck, my phone is "rose gold" (aka let's not kid anyone, it's pink).
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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby MUTU » Wed Aug 09, 2017 4:13 pm

FCBayernMunchen wrote:I think I've read something about this before but can't recall at the moment.

LovinMalta IIRC.
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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby ramsej84 » Wed Aug 09, 2017 4:32 pm

MUTU wrote:
FCBayernMunchen wrote:
ramsej84 wrote:No, I think it is a natural thing...
Girls play with dolls cause of their maternal instinct ...

On the other hand boys are tough and even the way they play is different; they push, climb, run, make more dangerous stunts etc.

But what about pink/blue for instance?

Weird thing about pink and blue is that a while back the colours were inverted: pink was considered masculine while blue was considered feminine. Apparently it was the French who switched them around to what is currently considered the norm of pink for girls and blue for boys.
I shall put this in the " today I learned thread"

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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby ramsej84 » Wed Aug 09, 2017 4:34 pm

FCBayernMunchen wrote:
MUTU wrote:Weird thing about pink and blue is that a while back the colours were inverted: pink was considered masculine while blue was considered feminine. Apparently it was the French who switched them around to what is currently considered the norm of pink for girls and blue for boys.

I think I've read something about this before but can't recall at the moment.

P.S. Pink is actually one of my favourite colours, in all of its shades but especially light pink. Heck, my phone is "rose gold" (aka let's not kid anyone, it's pink).
...
And have you ever listened to the song by aerosmith, "Pink"?

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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby Hardrade » Wed Aug 09, 2017 5:06 pm

MUTU wrote:
FCBayernMunchen wrote:
ramsej84 wrote:No, I think it is a natural thing...
Girls play with dolls cause of their maternal instinct ...

On the other hand boys are tough and even the way they play is different; they push, climb, run, make more dangerous stunts etc.

But what about pink/blue for instance?

Weird thing about pink and blue is that a while back the colours were inverted: pink was considered masculine while blue was considered feminine. Apparently it was the French who switched them around to what is currently considered the norm of pink for girls and blue for boys.


Any source on that? I'd like to hear more
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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby MUTU » Wed Aug 09, 2017 5:20 pm

^ Try this for a good read.
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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby Mavs » Thu Aug 10, 2017 3:04 am

MUTU wrote:
Mavs wrote:
MUTU wrote:German-American, it's ironic you would use the word "persecuted" when it's actually the LGBT community who are on the receiving end in the vast majority of instances. I think not liking the Allianz colours has much to do with the way you interpret the 'stunt' (I hope nobody gets sensitive by this word!): to me it means "hey, there are LGBT around, please show respect". That's all I get as an interpretation.

Let's use another sensitive topic for comparison. There are black people, Africans, who migrate to traditionally-Caucasian countries. Some people don't want them in their country. They're called racists (just like anti-gays are called homophobes). However nobody bats an eyelid when FIFA put slogans like "let's kick racism out of football". It's basically similar to them saying "let's accept gays".


It's only similar if a) the moral dimension is removed and we all universally agree that there is nothing morally wrong about homosexuality (which people don't agree on) and b) if being homosexual is as innate and inherent as the color of someone's skin.

Those are two highly questionable assumptions. So no, it's not the same.
Disagree on both.

In (a) you assume that nobody believes some races are better than others. If that was the case then we wouldn't be talking about racism as it would be a non-issue.

In (b) you claim homosexuality is not innate and yet several studies claim the exact opposite. People may be born gay just like they may be born black.


A) Huh? How is my argument based on the premise that "nobody believes some races are better than others?"

B) "Several studies," huh? The reality is that that the people conducting research in this field are filled entirely with people seeking to somehow "prove" that people are born homosexual, and yet they've been unable to do so, after decades and decades of research. That is quite revealing.
People "may" be born gay - sure. But again, that's far from a certainty.
Last edited by Mavs on Thu Aug 10, 2017 3:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby Mavs » Thu Aug 10, 2017 3:06 am

FCBayernMunchen wrote:
#12 wrote:Maybe #2 is, I don't think being homosexual is DNA based either...

I might get some hate for this (not from you, you probably agree), but let's say it's not biological at all. Let's say being gay/bi/trans is 100% a choice (which I don't believe): so what? So what if it's a choice and not biological? Does that mean you can treat them as inferior or discriminate against them?

Having tattoos is a choice, and unfortunately many hold biases against tattooed people, which I disagree with entirely. To me it would be almost the same thing.


It's not about "treating people as inferior."

It's about not having something that millions and millions of people find not only morally objectionable, but also, frankly, gross and disgusting, rubbed in your face.

And that's the problem with the modern LGBTQINHKBGYJBAHKBHA movement. They aren't satisfied with mere tolerance. They want to coerce you into agreeing with and endorsing them - or else.
Last edited by Mavs on Thu Aug 10, 2017 3:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby Mavs » Thu Aug 10, 2017 3:08 am

The fact that so many homosexuals, transsexuals, etc. come from broken families (and as a result, are more commonly the target of abuse than people who grew up in stable home with their two biological parents) is proof of the fact that it is at the very least in large part a result of one's environment. It's very often a response to trauma.

Is that always the case? I can hardly say. But then, I don't think it matters, as someone else has pointed out.
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Re: LGBT Allianz Arena triggers homophobic reactions

Postby Roonzil » Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:17 pm

ramsej84 wrote:No, I think it is a natural thing...
Girls play with dolls cause of their maternal instinct ...

On the other hand boys are tough and even the way they play is different; they push, climb, run, make more dangerous stunts etc.


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