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Bayern Munich or Germany

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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:03 pm

zippy wrote:How can anybody "support" a national team different to their own anyway ? That's pathetic.


I agree. Over here no one really supports our NT, but we're hardly left with a choice since Malta never plays in big tournaments. :lol: So I support Germany... although when they played against Malta I was 100% hoping for Malta to win (although had Malta won that one, I would have died with fear of what would happen to Germany in the WC as it was a couple of weeks before it :lol: )
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby MaCk0y » Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:27 pm

zippy wrote:How can anybody "support" a national team different to their own anyway ? That's pathetic.


You have to be in our position to understand. :wink:
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby TuesdayMorning » Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:20 pm

zippy wrote:How can anybody "support" a national team different to their own anyway ?


Canada has made the World Cup once, in 1986. I was not even a year old. It's hard to build a loyalty to a team when you never really see them play. In CONCACAF games I support Canada but internationally I don't. I've gone for Germany for so long now that I'd still root for them even if Canada were ever to make it to the World Cup again. I'll stick to supporting Canada in hockey and Germany in football (but hoping that the other team at least has a decent run).
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby quaazi » Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:04 pm

zippy wrote:
How can anybody "support" a national team different to their own anyway ? That's pathetic.

I love how you assume that every person on the planet (the 7-odd million of them) live in a top footballing nations. Allow me to correct that, in a footballing nation period. My team gets to play a couple of games a year against teams like Latvia or the Faroes (and **** that up too :roll: ).

And still, I'd support my own team over any other any day of the week, even if it's Germany or Bayern.
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby zippy » Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:17 pm

quaazi wrote:I love how you assume that every person on the planet (the 7-odd million of them) live in a top footballing nations.


No I don't. England never win anything either but I'm English, so I support them. My team in England (Sheffield United) never wins anything either, that's just tough, I have to cope with it. We can't all be plastic Chelsea fans.
When I moved to Germany I lived in Munich and yes that was lucky. If I'd lived in Bochum or Bielefeld I'd have a season ticket for them now and not for Bayern.
I just don't really like glory hunters, someone from Singapore who probably couldn't find Manchester on a map claiming to "support" Man United is ridiculous imo. Buying a shirt and watching Sky don't count.
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby zippy » Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:22 pm

MaCk0y wrote:
zippy wrote:How can anybody "support" a national team different to their own anyway ? That's pathetic.


You have to be in our position to understand. :wink:


I visit Malta from time to time and watch the BOV league when I'm there. I always watch for Malta's results in qualifiers and hope they do well but as I'm not Maltese I can't say I support them even though I'd like to see them win.
Of course when watching any international you generally want one of the teams to win but that's not the same as passionately supporting one of them.
For instance I found all those Japanese dressed in England shirts cheering us on at the 2002 World Cup embarrassing.
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby Payam » Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:28 pm

So basically you have to live in a particular city, or by some other relation have connection or roots there, to be a "true supporter" of the team of the city.
Am I getting this right? :)
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby quaazi » Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:58 pm

zippy wrote:No I don't. England never win anything either but I'm English, so I support them. My team in England (Sheffield United) never wins anything either, that's just tough, I have to cope with it.

Yeees you do. Sheffield United is a very big team compared any over here. A Sheffield fan can have a ton more football than any fan of my NT or the local clubs. So you're missing the point altogether. Winning isn't important - being a proper football team who can compete with similarly strong teams in many competitions is what a fan needs, you know, the prerequisites of actually being able to be a fan of a club. My national team can barely beat the minnows of Europe, and any games happen like twice or thrice a year. You can't support a team like that if you want to follow football regularly.

What I am saying is - you're assuming I have anything to root for over here, which I do not. Our national team plays very few games per year, and the few good local clubs have to play de facto amateurs (that is people who make a living with jobs other than football), and there's nothing interesting or fascinating about cheering for a pub team in a league in which half the player show up hung over or better yet, drunk. So how about you get off your cliched high horse and that medieval attitude towards football fandom, that'd be nice.
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby zippy » Mon Jul 04, 2011 5:18 pm

Payam wrote:So basically you have to live in a particular city, or by some other relation have connection or roots there, to be a "true supporter" of the team of the city.
Am I getting this right? :)


Yes imo that's exactly right. A supporter supports. You get these arguments on all football websites, glory seekers v the rest. We can agree to disagree, we all have our opinions and we all have a right to those opinions.
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby zippy » Mon Jul 04, 2011 5:27 pm

quaazi wrote:Yeees you do. Sheffield United is a very big team compared any over here. A Sheffield fan can have a ton more football than any fan of my NT or the local clubs. So you're missing the point altogether. Winning isn't important - being a proper football team who can compete with similarly strong teams in many competitions is what a fan needs, you know, the prerequisites of actually being able to be a fan of a club. My national team can barely beat the minnows of Europe, and any games happen like twice or thrice a year. You can't support a team like that if you want to follow football regularly.

What I am saying is - you're assuming I have anything to root for over here, which I do not. Our national team plays very few games per year, and the few good local clubs have to play de facto amateurs (that is people who make a living with jobs other than football), and there's nothing interesting or fascinating about cheering for a pub team in a league in which half the player show up hung over or better yet, drunk. So how about you get off your cliched high horse and that medieval attitude towards football fandom, that'd be nice.


We won the fourth division in 1982, that's all I've ever seen us win. I've watched United for about 40 years, most of the football was absolute crap. I don't know where you are so I'm not "assuming" anything.

My attitude to football fandom is every bit as valid as yours. I don't like the idea of simply picking a club to support, that is my given right.
It's also no accident that 99% of people pick the likes of Bayern, Barcelona, Man Utd, AC Milan etc they never pick Hannover, Wigan, Getafe or Udinese.
For me it's just glory hunting. You can disagree, but a hell of a lot of fans agree. If I was a Man Utd fan from Manchester for instance I'd hate seeing the buses full of bandwagon jumpers from Ireland, Belgium, southern England etc turning up at games every two weeks.
If a foreign guy lives in Manchester and gets into supporting them then fine, even if he moves away he has a connection with the club and the fans.
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby Conquistador » Mon Jul 04, 2011 5:29 pm

^Not many people choose Bayern as a clyub for glory hunting. The most glory hunters 'support' BARCA and MANURE....
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby Payam » Mon Jul 04, 2011 5:41 pm

zippy wrote:
Payam wrote:So basically you have to live in a particular city, or by some other relation have connection or roots there, to be a "true supporter" of the team of the city.
Am I getting this right? :)


Yes imo that's exactly right. A supporter supports. You get these arguments on all football websites, glory seekers v the rest. We can agree to disagree, we all have our opinions and we all have a right to those opinions.


Yes, indeed we have those rights. I believe some guys died for us to have those rights.
But still, I find it funny that, by your logic, more than half, nay, more than 80 per cent of the users here (this is an international forum after all) can never love and support Bayern the way you do. :mrgreen:

In my own humble opinion, I believe that if you identify yourself with a particular club, feel and burn for that club through the good times and bad then you are a supporter. After all, if I'm not mistaken, us international fans are a great part of Bayerns international economy (shirt sales etc.)
And if we identify ourselves enough with the club to pay a hefty, hard earned 80 Euros, our support, for a piece of cloth that will be old and out of practice faster than Oprah gains weight, then are we not "real enough" supporters? :wink:
Bayern would be much poorer without us, as would Man U, AC Milan etc. The international supporters.

But, that is just what I believe. :)
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby quaazi » Mon Jul 04, 2011 6:05 pm

zippy wrote:We won the fourth division in 1982, that's all I've ever seen us win. I've watched United for about 40 years, most of the football was absolute crap. I don't know where you are so I'm not "assuming" anything.

Again, you're missing my point. You have a dedicated football team playing high-level football with professional players, as opposed to the teams around here, which are neither.

zippy wrote:My attitude to football fandom is every bit as valid as yours. I don't like the idea of simply picking a club to support, that is my given right.
It's also no accident that 99% of people pick the likes of Bayern, Barcelona, Man Utd, AC Milan etc they never pick Hannover, Wigan, Getafe or Udinese.
For me it's just glory hunting. You can disagree, but a hell of a lot of fans agree. If I was a Man Utd fan from Manchester for instance I'd hate seeing the buses full of bandwagon jumpers from Ireland, Belgium, southern England etc turning up at games every two weeks.
If a foreign guy lives in Manchester and gets into supporting them then fine, even if he moves away he has a connection with the club and the fans.

You don't have a "given right", there's no UN resolution regulating the aspects of football fandom in the way you think. You and a hell of a lot of fans are douchenozzles, and your view of football fandom is akin to medieval serfdom.

Maybe you'd try thinking about how life is outside England and Germany and the other great footballing nations? What exposure do I have to Hannover, Wigan, Getafe or Udinese? How can I even ever know these teams exist without getting into football proper? If I, as a kid who is playing football with other kids in a yard with a couple of sticks designated as posts and one very valuable (for us) ball, watch a top tournament a la the World Cup or the Champions League (as they are the only competitions getting any kind of coverage), like a player because of his skill or athleticism or any other trait which makes him a good player and as such, an option for the top teams available, and take interest in that player, am I a bad person because he is a good player and inevitably plays in a good club as a result?

This is the fundamental difference. Your type views football as some kind of medieval territorial hereditary dick-wagging competition, rather than thinking about it as an actual sport. And for some reason you hate other people who like players because they are good players, and clubs because they are good clubs, which is kind of the point of sport as a competition of athletes in the first place.

Of course, I am glory hunting. Because I apparently think that crashing out just short of the target for the third World Cup in a row after getting my hopes up is "glorious", for some reason. Or a team that has made it to just one Champions League final in the last 10 years is particularly "glorious" - you don't see too many international AS Monaco fans, do you?

So what you have a right to do is be a jerk and complain in your pub to your equally jerk friends that modern football is a farce and supporting clubs because of how good at football they are is wrong and all those damn foreigners are ruining the sport. Whatever. But you do not have a right to believe that millions of people around the world are worse than you because they do not have the same opportunities than you.
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby MaCk0y » Mon Jul 04, 2011 6:46 pm

Cool it guys. Take it to the General Chat thread if you are going to keep arguing about this subject.
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Re: Bayern Munich or Germany

Postby zippy » Mon Jul 04, 2011 7:36 pm

Conquistador wrote:^Not many people choose Bayern as a clyub for glory hunting. The most glory hunters 'support' BARCA and MANURE....


They do in Germany.

Believe me Hildesheim alone has many Bayern "fans" who never even bother going to the games even when Bayern are in Hannover or Wolfsburg.
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