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2012/2013 Tactics & formations thread

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Re: 2012/2013 Tactics & formations thread

Postby quaazi » Tue May 28, 2013 5:00 pm

Also, all those plans which have Martinez play in CB really irk me. Have you guys seen him in midfield? His defensive play up the pitch is so good it's not even funny. Playing him deeper where he has no way to overlap into the box or make quick interceptions that lead to instant counters is wasting his talent.
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Re: 2012/2013 Tactics & formations thread

Postby Firefox1234 » Tue May 28, 2013 5:12 pm

quaazi wrote:Also, all those plans which have Martinez play in CB really irk me. Have you guys seen him in midfield? His defensive play up the pitch is so good it's not even funny. Playing him deeper where he has no way to overlap into the box or make quick interceptions that lead to instant counters is wasting his talent.


I agree! I think Pep played DM as CBs at Barca cause their board never allowed him to buy the quality CBs he needed. Barca in my opinion always played there best when Puyol and Pique played together and since Puyol always found himself on the injury table he could only rotate with DMs. At Bayern the situation is different he will actually have real CBs to rotate. Cause i cant believe a successful coach like Pep could keep Mascherano as a CB after all his blunders it just doesn't make sense...
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Re: 2012/2013 Tactics & formations thread

Postby Firefox1234 » Wed May 29, 2013 8:08 am

I am curious to know people's opinions on this issue that always seems to come up when discussing tactics and that is Toni Kroos. AM or CM? Where do you think he best fits?

Personally i think he is a through and through CM with, he is calm and collected even when pressed and always plays the game at his tempo. His passing range is beyond his age at 23. He doesn't need to be near the six yard box to do damage as his long shots are second to none. Also he lacks the pace to attack on a counter and to interchange on the wings like you see with modern AMs....
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Re: 2012/2013 Tactics & formations thread

Postby quaazi » Wed May 29, 2013 12:07 pm

His main value for us has been that he provides an extra man in midfield in a way Müller (or Shaq or Pizza when played there) doesn't. A passing trident of Schweini-Kroos-Martinez is extremely potent in possession. Basically, we sacrifice directness for possession with him on the pitch, although that is of course not exclusively the case (look at his goal v Dortmund).

I feel that if there is a nominal positional change for Kroos with Pep coming in, it's dropping deeper, yes, but in a 4-3-3 system. It really wouldn't be that huge of a change, considering he already likes to come very deep, but it would give him a new defensive role and release Schweinsteiger to go on the offensive even more.
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Re: 2012/2013 Tactics & formations thread

Postby MoFattal » Wed May 29, 2013 6:32 pm

^ I definitely agree there. Kroos is neither the complete CAM or CM in a 4-2-3-1 system, but he would be the complete package in a 4-3-3 system.
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Re: 2012/2013 Tactics & formations thread

Postby Aequitas1987 » Wed May 29, 2013 7:51 pm

Firefox1234 wrote:
Aequitas1987 wrote:I just had a thought what if Pep bought Gotze not to be our messi i.e. false nine or our Kroos replacement what if he bought him to be our Xavi? Do you think its realistic to assume that Pep pushes Martinez to CB and plays Gotze next to Schweinsteiger as a deep lying playmaker?



Umm.....no, not even Loew is stupid enough to play Gotze there. Im assuming you havent seen many BvB games or Gotze play, he is not a center midfielder he doesnt play that far away from the six yard box like Xavi. He is an attacking midfielder who can also play on either wing. Kroos is the type of player who can play in the midfield and dictate play there so if Pep is gonna play anyone there its Kroos not Gotze.....


I do watch a lot of BvB games I was just trying to get my head around all these purchases. I can understand Gotze and Lewandowski coming if we are selling Gomez and Robben but now with Robben definitely not going I am uncertain about what formation or what lineup we will start next season with. Kroos is definitely a better candidate for CM than Gotze is in terms of physicality but he does not in my opinion have the stamina to dictate pace from that deep for the whole match while putting in the defensive work as well.

I for one would also not want to mess with Martinez-Schweinsteiger duo in midfield but I think Gotze has the stamina to play CM and the vision to be a deep lying playmaker but he lacks in ball winning ability and physicality.

TLDR:
Best case is obviously keeping Martinez in CM but if that is not the case Gotze in my opinion is as much of an option as Kroos is.

If its a 4-3-3 then Schweinsteiger as the sole CDM with Gotze and Kroos as CM's is also a possibility.

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Re: 2012/2013 Tactics & formations thread

Postby Kinkam » Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:00 pm

Lets not kid ourselves, someone very good is going to be sitting on the bench just like Gomez has. Someone we likely love. Maybe Robben is the easy one out because he's played the super sub role well this season, its spurred him on. But if they all begin fit it will be hard to bench the dutch. His early season injuries make it easier to pick the first eleven before he rebounds back in style after the winter break.

Also, Uli revealed Pep wanted Neymar before he ever wanted Gotze. Gotze was a suggestion by the board. These two players aren't similar in how they play. Neymar is more of a Ribery in style. So the assumption that Gotze will definitely be in the lineup might not be the case. E.g. would he start for the NT if it wasn't in the false 9 role. Would he oust Muller on the right, Reus on the left, Ozil in the middle..I think not. Well, add Robbery & Bayern has a better front 4 than the NT.
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Re: 2012/2013 Tactics & formations thread

Postby Firefox1234 » Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:23 pm

Kinkam wrote:Lets not kid ourselves, someone very good is going to be sitting on the bench just like Gomez has. Someone we likely love. Maybe Robben is the easy one out because he's played the super sub role well this season, its spurred him on. But if they all begin fit it will be hard to bench the dutch. His early season injuries make it easier to pick the first eleven before he rebounds back in style after the winter break.

Also, Uli revealed Pep wanted Neymar before he ever wanted Gotze. Gotze was a suggestion by the board. These two players aren't similar in how they play. Neymar is more of a Ribery in style. So the assumption that Gotze will definitely be in the lineup might not be the case. E.g. would he start for the NT if it wasn't in the false 9 role. Would he oust Muller on the right, Reus on the left, Ozil in the middle..I think not. Well, add Robbery & Bayern has a better front 4 than the NT.


In my opinion Neymar is more of a Robben type player, always trying to free himself for a shot on goal. He doesnt seems much if a creater like Ribery who soaks up pressure to free up a teammate for a pass......
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Re: 2012/2013 Tactics & formations thread

Postby USBayernMunichFan » Thu Jun 27, 2013 5:50 pm

Guardiola ponders No. 10 role for Ribery

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/guardiola- ... --sow.html


You just knew Pep wasn't going to be afraid to shake things up ... if nothing else, it's going to be fun to see how he pieces it all together.
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Re: 2012/2013 Tactics & formations thread

Postby Firefox1234 » Thu Jun 27, 2013 10:14 pm

Someone should lock this thread its a news season last time i checked the tactically discussions are here:http://www.bayernforum.com/general-bayern-f13/2013-2014-tactics-formations-thread-t9221.html
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