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2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby #12 » Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:21 pm

There's tons of these (and I don't necessarily disagree...!), I seriously don't understand your issue with this, as long as it doesn't concern you...
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby aterford » Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:28 pm

Hardrade wrote:^
^

Football as a word was used in fourteenth century, way before any kind of 'association' (based on which the term soccer was coined).

The only real reason why 'soccer' still exist as a term is because some people believe that you can name a sport foot-ball regardless of the fact that it uses neither feet nor actual ball.


Not exactly accurate. The name football was used in many contexts but the sport we know was called as association football (so as to distinguish from "rugby football") in the 1860s. The 14th-century 'football' you're referencing bears little similarity to the modern (read: post 1800's) game that we know and it's disingenuous to suggest that naming conventions should follow this model - at such time it was simply just transliterated as "foot-ball". But using these archaic naming conventions are silly when they come from a time prior to the formal organisation of the sport.
As you may know, we get 'soccer' as an abbreviation of 'association' (wherein at the same at the same time "rugby football" was often called "rugger", "brekkers" for breakfast, etc). At minimum, we can safely conclude that "football" and "soccer" were used both interchangeably and simultaneously. In the 1860s when the game was first codified there was absolutely no pushback to the term "soccer" being used; at the time, it was understood by all that "association football" and "soccer" were the same game. For well over 100 years there was no adverse reaction whatsoever to the use of the word "soccer."
However, over time, "soccer" became predominantly used by the upper-class citizens in the UK whereas "football" was the predominant term used by the middle and lower-class. As the class-gap widened, "soccer" (as a name) fell out of vogue and the negative reaction to the word "soccer" was in large part due to a negative reaction to the rich and upper-class in general.

In whatever case, just as "association football" was given its name so as to distinguish from "rugby football," "soccer" was also used in the same way so as to distinguish from "American football." There is nothing at all wrong with this, and there's no cogent argument for why one shouldn't use the word "soccer." To speak down to someone simply because of their choice of word (especially when it's a correct one) just smacks of Euro-snobbery.

There's absolutely nothing wrong with calling it soccer.
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby JANCKER » Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:20 pm

If someone uses the word soccer, I automatically assume that he doesn't know much about the sport.

The word 'soccer' is a slang abbreviation of 'association'. Football it is... :coffee:
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby ramsej84 » Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:36 pm

Table soccer

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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby JANCKER » Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:39 pm

ramsej84 wrote:Table soccer

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Table association #-o
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Sun Aug 06, 2017 5:49 pm

@aterford: very interesting. There's much I didn't know there.
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby MUTU » Sun Aug 06, 2017 5:50 pm

ramsej84 wrote:Table soccer

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Funny thing is that Americans call table soccer by a different name... They use foosball.
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby YlonenXabi » Sun Aug 06, 2017 7:34 pm

MUTU, that's way off topic :coffee:
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby #12 » Sun Aug 06, 2017 7:46 pm

MUTU wrote:
ramsej84 wrote:Table soccer

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Funny thing is that Americans call table soccer by a different name... They use foosball.


Which I would use as well... Ridiculous? Don't think so...
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby Hardrade » Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:10 pm

Funny thing is, I was not starting an argument - just ridiculing his choice of words. It is not a product of rational thought, but a honest reaction to something out of place - at least from my perspective.

I did, however, respond to Aterford within the limits of my knowledge about the word, but that was still not the aim of the initial comment whatsoever, nor did I anticipate conversation to sway in that direction :D

Thank you, Aterford, for caring to explain and approach this constructively, it was informational at least, but still redundant in a sense that I was not challenging the word in any rational manner, so it did not need a honorable defender. :D
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby aterford » Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:23 pm

JANCKER wrote:If someone uses the word soccer, I automatically assume that he doesn't know much about the sport.

The word 'soccer' is a slang abbreviation of 'association'. Football it is... :coffee:



Well, that's a totally baseless assumption, but you do you I guess.

As I've already explained, it's an abbreviation of "association football". Not just "association". And again: for over 100 years "soccer" was used interchangeably with "football" and nobody complained or looked down on someone or assumed they didn't know about the sport for using it. The blowback against the word "Soccer" - people assuming that someone who says "soccer" doesn't know about the sport - is a relatively recent invention.
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby aterford » Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:24 pm

Hardrade wrote:Funny thing is, I was not starting an argument - just ridiculing his choice of words. It is not a product of rational thought, but a honest reaction to something out of place - at least from my perspective.

I did, however, respond to Aterford within the limits of my knowledge about the word, but that was still not the aim of the initial comment whatsoever, nor did I anticipate conversation to sway in that direction :D

Thank you, Aterford, for caring to explain and approach this constructively, it was informational at least, but still redundant in a sense that I was not challenging the word in any rational manner, so it did not need a honorable defender. :D


Haha. All good. :)
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby MUTU » Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:34 am

#12 wrote:
MUTU wrote:
ramsej84 wrote:Table soccer

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Funny thing is that Americans call table soccer by a different name... They use foosball.


Which I would use as well... Ridiculous? Don't think so...

It IS ridiculous if you use it in Germany. It'd sound like you're trying to say Fußball with an English accent.
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby #12 » Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:01 am

Which is probably how the term was coined anyway...
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Re: 2017/18 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread

Postby PunkCapitalist » Mon Aug 07, 2017 2:24 pm

#12 wrote:Thing is: this is the 21st century - and people can name stuff whatever the frick they want
Not Armorball though; it shouldn't be called football.

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