Unofficial FC Bayern Forum

armbrust wrote:Keep playing 4-2-3-1

I agree with this. Both last season and so far in pre-season and the early games of the season, we have found it hard to score. I don't think the 4-2-3-1 is working for us. We need a 2-striker formation, they have always worked best for Bayern.

The problem is, how?

4-4-2 would mean either playing Muller as striker or not playing him at all, and Muller is definitely one of the players we can't afford to drop.
4-3-3, in my opinion, is not that different from 4-2-3-1. I prefer it, but I do not think it will make much of a difference.

Then there is the diamond I suggested a couple of days ago in the tactics thread, which somehow fits in all the players, but I myself am doubtful that will work when both Ribery and Robben are fit...

So it's a bit of a headache. However, even though I believe we lost because of bad luck and because it is too early in the season, I do agree that we need to change our formation. Our sole striker thing is simply not working, we've found it hard to score too many times.

FCBayernMunchen wrote:4-4-2 would mean either playing Muller as striker or not playing him at all, and Muller is definitely one of the players we can't afford to drop.

Muller can play as a second striker. Come to think of it, our best performances with LVG were when playing with 4-4-2 or to be more precise, 4-2-2-2 with Muller beside Olic (vs Lyon, ManU first leg etc.).

That 4-2-3-1 somehow does not suit us.

FCBayernMunchen wrote:Then there is the diamond I suggested a couple of days ago in the tactics thread, which somehow fits in all the players, but I myself am doubtful that will work when both Ribery and Robben are fit...

It will be useful with both Robbery injured (e.g. game vs Juve), but with both being fit they are best in the wings / attacking role, so a diamond is not recommended.

What worries me:
- Schweinsteiger: I feel he's fading.
- Kroos: I don't have worries for him, in fact I'm sure, this guy will never become an "Oezil"...
- Playing against teams that park the bus in front of their goal...

cyberalex wrote:What worries me:
- Schweinsteiger: I feel he's fading.
- Kroos: I don't have worries for him, in fact I'm sure, this guy will never become an "Oezil"...
- Playing against teams that park the bus in front of their goal...

True.

4-4-2 would mean either playing Muller as striker or not playing him at all, and Muller is definitely one of the players we can't afford to drop.
4-3-3, in my opinion, is not that different from 4-2-3-1.

Actually i think muller is the best striker we have, good finishing, good air play, awesome ball control, spark,speed,acceleration,agility,and the most important part:hes awesome stealing balls from defenders.

About the 4-3-3 the diference is that we will have robbery more close to the box, so for sure they will be more efective.

AvatarX wrote:Muller can play as a second striker.

We kind of lose Muller's creativity like that, and Muller is the most creative player we have (judging by current form).

Still, maybe it will be more effective than the 4-2-3-1... with the 4-2-3-1 we have had mostly inconsistent results. We did score a lot of goals last season, but we also had a lot of games were like yesterday, we found it hard to score. The large number of goals scored was mostly thanks to a few good days (Hamburg, Leverkusen, etc)

It's time we left the possession football idea once and for all. It will only ever work for us in the CL, and LVG's era shows that. In his first season, we reached the final of the CL, although luck did play it's part. Last season, we got eliminated early but we played well in the CL. We had one of our best group stages in recent years, won in San Siro against Inter, and were clearly the dominant team in the return against Inter. These last two seasons, the defense was our problem in the CL, not the tactics.

When it comes to the BL, we cannot play the same possession style football which brought us good results in the CL. Most Bundesliga teams will content themselves with a draw against us. We know that nearly every team will be playing with 10 man in the box. There is no point in keeping possession, you're just wasting time and playing right into the opponent's hands. In the Bundesliga, we have two options. Either attack, attack, attack, shooting at every chance you get even if you are far out (Think of the Juve game in Turin, this is what I'm talking about), or else counter-attacking. Jonker's tactics were perfect for the BL, he knew exactly what he was doing. Some of you will probably remember that I had said that we may yet regret having already agreed terms with Heynckes and not keeping Jonker. We will see. I still have faith in Heynckes. I do hope though, that if for some reason Heynckes fails, the board will appoint Jonker again,

What worries me is:

-Boateng getting injured = DVB playing
-Usami, Alaba, Petersen not given enough playing time
-Olic to be forgotten

vijay92 wrote:Not at all, it can only get better than last season.

Sorry, I realised that there are worries
1. Dortmund teaching Bayern lesson about modern/successful football
2. Bayern continuing to play 1D footbal
3. Neuer gets affected by the schikeria
4. kroos doesnt achieve his potential
5. Badstuber doesn't look good next to a good defender ( boateng not dvb)
6. Rafinha forgets about defending
7. Nerlinger continues to talk crap
8. Gomez turns into ( I am not going to say that name )
9. Schweinsteiger lives in 2010 but forgets to play like it
10. Lahm gets angry (it doesnt suit him)
11. Usami, Alaba, petersen, and olic are completely forgotten.
12. Tymo and gustavo continue to be play at the same level but forget to step it up.
13. Pranjic, we all start remembering that he is a bayern player.
14. Heynckes forgets about the way he managed in Leverkusen ( good football) or real madrId ( won the cl).
15.van buyten in the starting eleven
16.muller gets affected by the rest
17. Ribery has another affair
18. Boateng tries to be cool with his shoes rather than his performances
19. Robben talks about how shit the europa league but forgets to perform to make sure there is no Europa league

That's some of my new found worries.

vijay92 wrote:Sorry, I realised that there are worries
1. Dortmund teaching Bayern lesson about modern/successful football
2. Bayern continuing to play 1D footbal
3. Neuer gets affected by the schikeria
4. kroos doesnt achieve his potential
5. Badstuber doesn't look good next to a good defender ( boateng not dvb)
6. Rafinha forgets about defending
7. Nerlinger continues to talk crap
8. Gomez turns into ( I am not going to say that name )
9. Schweinsteiger lives in 2010 but forgets to play like it
10. Lahm gets angry (it doesnt suit him)
11. Usami, Alaba, petersen, and olic are completely forgotten.
12. Tymo and gustavo continue to be play at the same level but forget to step it up.
13. Pranjic, we all start remembering that he is a bayern player.
14. Heynckes forgets about the way he managed in Leverkusen ( good football) or real madrId ( won the cl).
15.van buyten in the starting eleven
16.muller gets affected by the rest
17. Ribery has another affair
18. Boateng tries to be cool with his shoes rather than his performances
19. Robben talks about how shit the europa league but forgets to perform to make sure there is no Europa league

Dude

19 Worries !!

Damn , 3rd division Club have less than that

I am worry about Robben losing more hair, he already looks twice the age he is

vijay92 wrote:

vijay92 wrote:Not at all, it can only get better than last season.

Sorry, I realised that there are worries
1. Dortmund teaching Bayern lesson about modern/successful football
2. Bayern continuing to play 1D footbal
3. Neuer gets affected by the schikeria
4. kroos doesnt achieve his potential
5. Badstuber doesn't look good next to a good defender ( boateng not dvb)
6. Rafinha forgets about defending
7. Nerlinger continues to talk crap
8. Gomez turns into ( I am not going to say that name )
9. Schweinsteiger lives in 2010 but forgets to play like it
10. Lahm gets angry (it doesnt suit him)
11. Usami, Alaba, petersen, and olic are completely forgotten.
12. Tymo and gustavo continue to be play at the same level but forget to step it up.
13. Pranjic, we all start remembering that he is a bayern player.
14. Heynckes forgets about the way he managed in Leverkusen ( good football) or real madrId ( won the cl).
15.van buyten in the starting eleven
16.muller gets affected by the rest
17. Ribery has another affair
18. Boateng tries to be cool with his shoes rather than his performances
19. Robben talks about how shit the europa league but forgets to perform to make sure there is no Europa league

That's some of my new found worries.

this gotta be the best post ever... As contradicting as it sounds, I always have a blast listening to an extreme pessimist. You can't really take them very seriously. It just reminds of my office mate, his always seeing the negative side of everything. "you won the lottery!" "damm it, I bet doing my taxes are gonna be really complicates now and who knows how much my whore of an ex-wife is gonna be able to suck out of it..."

4-4-2 would mean either playing Muller as striker or not playing him at all, and Muller is definitely one of the players we can't afford to drop.

If we can't afford to drop him then it's logical that we drop someone else. I keep hearing the same argument over and over and you guys just have to realize that Muller is up there with Robben and if we can't be convinced (I am) that he is better than Gomez and Ribery, then there is no point in saying what you just said. The bottom line is, if we need to change the tactical formation we will regarless of who gets dropped.

walter wrote:If we can't afford to drop him then it's logical that we drop someone else. I keep hearing the same argument over and over and you guys just have to realize that Muller is up there with Robben and if we can't be convinced (I am) that he is better than Gomez and Ribery, then there is no point in saying what you just said. The bottom line is, if we need to change the tactical formation we will regarless of who gets dropped.

You raise a good point. Sometimes you have to make sacrifices. Personally, for me, Muller would the last player I would drop. I'd rather drop Robbery. I think it is time we start thinking to move on from them. For one thing, they are too injury prone. For another, when they play we are too dependent on them and become too predictable. This is a very big concern.

Perhaps we should start thinking of going down the Barca route. They weren't afraid to sell their players Ronaldinho, Eto... even Henry can be included in that list. Yet every time, they came out stronger than before.

Robbery will be helpful and should be used whenever available, even as super subs, but I think it is about time we start shaping a new starting 11 which does NOT include them. A starting 11 which is capable of competing for all titles WITHOUT them. They will just be added bonuses whenever available, until they get fed up and leave.

To get back to your post, while dropping a certain player to make a tactical change is a risk we should be willing to take, the issue here is that the problem is that we seem uninspired in attack, despite all our quality players. Dropping Muller, Gomez, Robben or Ribery would just make that even worse, I think, unless Olic rediscovers his 2010 form.

I worry that I will too frequently have that same sick and lost feeling I had after we lost to BMG on Sunday.

OhioFan wrote:I worry that I will too frequently have that same sick and lost feeling I had after we lost to BMG on Sunday.

:lol: :lol: Thinking the same. As going along with this I worry that the team stays in some mental slump of under-achieving, we need to bring back the hunger -- that's why Dortmund is winning, they still have that hunger, being a youthful team has its positives I guess.