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[2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Discussions on the German Bundesliga matches.

What is your prediction for this match?

Poll ended at Sat Dec 03, 2011 3:30 pm

Bayern Munich will win
9
90%
It will end in a draw
0
No votes
Werder Bremen will win
1
10%
 
Total votes : 10

Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby Mr.S » Sat Dec 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Yea we got overwhelmed with the whole Robbery stuff. Surely with Robben we are on a whole different level.

But there are problems. Boateng is more or less decently solid as RB but he offers very little going forward. You could see how much Lahm was offering moving forward. The Central Defense is a massive issue as well. I am sorry none of the CB's seem amazing. And Gustavo sadly he is not at his best. Muller is very weak as RW,you can see how better he is in the centre where he is more of goal-threat winning penalties,effectively doubling as a striker.

Kroos is the only one I would say had a massive Game. HUGE HUGE improvement over the season. Could seriously bench Schweni as CM or Ozil as CAM in the NT in the near future.
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Sat Dec 03, 2011 5:31 pm

The central defense issue will be taken care of once we start playing Boateng there. I am convinced of that.
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby YlonenXabi » Sat Dec 03, 2011 5:36 pm

FCBayernMunchen wrote:The central defense issue will be taken care of once we start playing Boateng there. I am convinced of that.



With Schweini back and Boateng-Rafinha as CB and RB our defensive problems will be gone. We will probably need a backup CB though
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby MUTU » Sat Dec 03, 2011 5:42 pm

quaazi wrote:
AvatarX wrote:
He was amazing, quick, great dribbling, great finish. One of our top attackers we had.

Elber was a beast of a player, never understood why he didn't succeed in the international stage...


Apparently he had a bust-up with the Brazil coach, but anyway they had Ronaldo and Rivaldo so people didn't pressure him to play Elber.
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby Aequitas1987 » Sat Dec 03, 2011 5:45 pm

Maybe we should play Gustavo and Boateng as CB's for the effective speed/physicality/strength. Also did you guys notice when those two were double teaming any opponent, no one was making it through. They seem to understand each other even when Gustavo is CDM and Boateng is RB.

I mean what if we had

-----------------Neuer------------
Rafinha-Boateng-Gustavo-Lahm
-------Schweinsteiger-Kroos-----
Robben-------Muller-------Ribery
--------------Gomez---------------

+ I feel with a back 4 like that we wont struggle against counter-attacking teams because all 4 of them are quick.

+ Secondly, Gustavo can quickly fall into a very deep CDM role when both Schweinsteiger and Kroos are pushing up which is basically what Van Buyten tries to do for us a lot but hes not as good at it. And we all know, that is his strength, ball-winning and playing a pure CDM not a distributor. If they do somehow get past Gustavo, Boateng/Lahm are quick enough to cover for him, not to mention Neuer.

+ As long as Kroos keeps on improving at the rate he is, in terms of work-rate and ball-winning, we will have a pretty solid shield in front of our defense instead of worrying about using Tymo there. Think about it, the opponents have to get through Gomez then Muller then Schweinsteiger then Kroos then Gustavo and Boateng if they want to work through the center all of them have some of the highest work-rates in Bayern (especially if Kroos keeps on improving).

- On set-piece defense we won't have the Height of Badstuber and Van Buyten...but umm...they were not any good anyway, especially for their height. :lol:

- Van Buytens threat FROM set pieces. HONESTLY, I think this is the MAIN REASON hes still in the lineup. Hes better than anyone on our team in Set Pieces.
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby MUTU » Sat Dec 03, 2011 5:49 pm

Amazing game. I love it when we play Bremen, because the game is always a high-scoring entertaining match since they play an attacking game. It was highly entertaining! Ribery scored 2, Robben scored 2 penalties and had that good dribbling action, and Gomez should have had 2 goals too but one was stolen by the linesman (disallowed for a non-existent offside) and the other by Ribery.
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Sat Dec 03, 2011 5:51 pm

Aequitas1987 wrote:I mean what if we had

-----------------Neuer------------
Rafinha-Boateng-Gustavo-Lahm
-------Schweinsteiger-Kroos-----
Robben-------Muller-------Ribery
--------------Gomez---------------

That could work...
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby YlonenXabi » Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:01 pm

I think we would concede a goal in every set piece

I know that Van Buyten is not good defending set pieces but that's just too much small guys
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby AvatarX » Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:07 pm

Mr.S wrote:Kroos is the only one I would say had a massive Game. HUGE HUGE improvement over the season. Could seriously bench Schweni as CM or Ozil as CAM in the NT in the near future.


Kroos was good (Ribery was best in this game IMHO), and way improved from last year, but not get carried away... He is far from being THAT good to bench Schweini or Oezil :)


Aequitas1987 wrote:-----------------Neuer------------
Rafinha-Boateng-Gustavo-Lahm
-------Schweinsteiger-Kroos-----
Robben-------Muller-------Ribery
--------------Gomez---------------


We could use this only in BL games against weaker opponents maybe, but even then, a defensive midfield duo containing 1 CM and 1 CAM would be too weak IMO. We need Gustavo or Tymo , 1 true CDM playing beside Schweini or Kroos to help our defense being solid.
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby AvatarX » Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:11 pm

MUTU wrote:
quaazi wrote:
AvatarX wrote:
He was amazing, quick, great dribbling, great finish. One of our top attackers we had.

Elber was a beast of a player, never understood why he didn't succeed in the international stage...


Apparently he had a bust-up with the Brazil coach, but anyway they had Ronaldo and Rivaldo so people didn't pressure him to play Elber.


I don't recall him having a bust-up with the coach, it was most because the competition there (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89lber ... nal_career).
Being at the starting XI of Brazil with all those super-stars attackers they were playing at time was one very difficult thing...
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby MoFattal » Sat Dec 03, 2011 8:02 pm

1) Subbing Alaba was the turning point of the game... I love the kid and all, but Alaba-Gustavo is a very weak central midfield pairing...
2) Robben will have his confidence boosted with his brace and nice dribbing + he tears apart defenses with his passes...
3) Muller best operates behind Gomez and with Robben on his side...
4) We should NEVER allow goals like the one Bremen scored ...... such goals can kick us out of CL or Pokal on a bad night... completely uncalled for and completely undeserved...
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby Mr.S » Sat Dec 03, 2011 8:53 pm

AvatarX wrote:
Mr.S wrote:Kroos is the only one I would say had a massive Game. HUGE HUGE improvement over the season. Could seriously bench Schweni as CM or Ozil as CAM in the NT in the near future.


Kroos was good (Ribery was best in this game IMHO), and way improved from last year, but not get carried away... He is far from being THAT good to bench Schweini or Oezil :)


Aequitas1987 wrote:-----------------Neuer------------
Rafinha-Boateng-Gustavo-Lahm
-------Schweinsteiger-Kroos-----
Robben-------Muller-------Ribery
--------------Gomez---------------


We could use this only in BL games against weaker opponents maybe, but even then, a defensive midfield duo containing 1 CM and 1 CAM would be too weak IMO. We need Gustavo or Tymo , 1 true CDM playing beside Schweini or Kroos to help our defense being solid.


I am talking about the future in 1-2 years if Kroos keeps on improving & the others have an off form who knows Kroos might take that spot permanently. He has come up in leaps & bounds & is now a player of the highest quality in Bayern. I am very impressed.
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby dambun » Sun Dec 04, 2011 1:58 am

We should not let the flattering 4-1 result fool us... We weren't as promising as it suggests except for the last half hour or so, when Robben came in.... Many of our players are performing well below their quality.... and our defense line is far from trustworthy....

Thomas Mueller once again showed how far he is from being fit... lacking the sharpness he usually has, he lost a lot of good opportunities... I know, he did quite well in our first 2 goals.... but that's just his class... we can't deny that he is totally out of form... whether it's a fitness problem or it has psychological problems I don't know... but it's definitely not about his RAM position... we should fix this ASAP.... because he is very very very important to our success....

The same goes for Manuel Neuer, whose class and brilliance saves us a lot of trouble every single match... but he is not in top form too... otherwise he shouldn't have conceded this goal... or Mainz's 2nd goal.... once again, I want to question our judgment in using a young inexperienced Tapalovic as our GK coach....

I think it's time JH uses the Bad-Boa combo once again.... The Bad-DvB combo is just too slow... and it's been proved more than I can remember....
Our Brasilians Gustavo and Rafinha also need to get it right ASAP... They both look out of form these days....

Seriously.... how could (almost) everything go so wrong for us these days???...
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby FCBayernMunchen » Sun Dec 04, 2011 9:53 am

Completely agree with you dambun. We were being outplayed before our first goal and also in the second half before our second goal. Other than that we were the better team, especially in the last 30 minutes after Robben came on.

There are still problems... but at least we've taken the first step and played well for a good part of the game, unlike against Mainz were we could have played for 180 minutes and would still have lost.
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Re: [2011-12-03] Bayern Munich vs Werder Bremen

Postby MUTU » Sun Dec 04, 2011 12:02 pm

I wouldn't say we were being outplayed in any part of the match. If anything, we were equally balanced. But the way we dominated the match when Robben came on was amazing. We scored 3 goals but it could easily have been 4 or 5 (in fact, a valid goal was disallowed)
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