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Sat Dec 23, 2006 12:33 am |
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tracylynn
I post all the time
Joined: 04 Oct 2006
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Location: Springfield, USA
  
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| Post subject: Kahn: Germany would have won the WC with me. |
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Kahn: It's only logical, Germany would have won the World Cup with me.
Former German international goalkeeper Oliver Kahn, relegated to the bench during the 2006 World Cup, has insisted it was only logical that they would have been world champions if he had been in goal.
With Jens Lehmann in goal hosts Germany finished third in the competition after being knocked out in the semi-finals by eventual champions Italy.
But 37-year old Kahn believes that logically he should have been first choice keeper.
"I'm not criticizing what Jens Lehmann did, but with me Germany would have been world champions," Kahn, 37, told weekly magazine Stern.
"In 1994 with Karlsruhe I reached the semi-finals of the UEFA Cup but two years later I won this trophy with Bayern Munich," he explained.
"In 1999, I lost the Champions League final in the harshest circumstances (losing 2-1 to Manchester United in stoppage time) before winning this competition two years later.
"Finally I lost the 2002 World Cup final (against Brazil).
"This logic, and I really believe in the law of series, should have continued at the 2006 World Cup," said Kahn.
Kahn, who is under contract with Bayern Munich until 2008, said that he had tried to explain his theory to World Cup coach Jurgen Klinsmann before the competition but 'he didn't understand or didn't want to understand.'
"I told him 'I don't understand why you won't admit that I'm right'," he added.
Germany previously won the World Cup in 1974 and 1990.
GOLTV, 22-12-2006
I'm not sure if I agree with Kahn on this. I'm not saying that they would have won with him but I think the whole cycle/series explanation does not hold true all the time. Firstly, the World Cup is a 4 year cycle and he won the previous title two years laters and not 4 years later. Also, cycles/series tend to get broken and don't hold true.
As much as I like Kahn, sometimes I think he's a little too conceited. I think he's still having a hard time accepting the fact that he did not start. |
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Sat Dec 23, 2006 10:51 am |
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bogdan
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Joined: 23 Aug 2006
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pfff
come on..
i think lehmann played well. its not lehmann's fault that Germany didn't win WC |
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Sun Dec 24, 2006 1:24 pm |
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yoanna
Yeah, now I'm talking!
Joined: 23 Dec 2006
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votes: 2
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so this is how you choose players to your team before an important game, based on 'law of series'.
how arrogant can you get... well, he's done his math.
still love him though. logically. |
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Sun Dec 24, 2006 1:31 pm |
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MUTU
Site Admin
Joined: 15 Aug 2006
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Location: Malta
votes: 8
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It's sad that we get to see the dark side of Kahn again. Clearly, he is wrong. Lehmann wasn't really at fault in any of the goals that Germany conceded. True, he might have communicated better with his defence and got them to close down the holes.
If Kahn had joined this forum and wrote that, I'd give him a bad reputation point for that!  |
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Sun Dec 24, 2006 3:50 pm |
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Miss Dangerous...!!
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Germany played well at the World Cup! but Italy were the better side  |
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Fri Dec 29, 2006 1:31 am |
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SNAKE
Yeah, now I'm talking!
Joined: 27 Dec 2006
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votes: 5
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I would have to agree with Oliver Kahn on this one, I think the team would have functioned a lot better with a solid figure and a VERY solid Captain in goal like Kahn and YES Lehmann had 2 or 3 faults in this World Cup, 1 was the 1st goal against Costa Rica, no communication in the defense line and he should have done better when attacking their attacker and the 2nd fault was against Sweden remember the game? Also he was chosen as the new "number 1" because he is with 1 of the best team in England, Arsenal and Klinsmann is a well known England lover, otherwise he wouldnt have even considered calling an idiot like Huth to the team.
SNAKE |
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Fri Dec 29, 2006 6:07 pm |
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dracus
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| SNAKE wrote: | I would have to agree with Oliver Kahn on this one, I think the team would have functioned a lot better with a solid figure and a VERY solid Captain in goal like Kahn and YES Lehmann had 2 or 3 faults in this World Cup, 1 was the 1st goal against Costa Rica, no communication in the defense line and he should have done better when attacking their attacker and the 2nd fault was against Sweden remember the game? Also he was chosen as the new "number 1" because he is with 1 of the best team in England, Arsenal and Klinsmann is a well known England lover, otherwise he wouldnt have even considered calling an idiot like Huth to the team.
SNAKE |
True |
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Fri Dec 29, 2006 9:49 pm |
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tracylynn
I post all the time
Joined: 04 Oct 2006
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Location: Springfield, USA
votes: 10
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They might've functioned better with Kahn but I don't think it would've made a big difference because Germany seemed weak when it came to their defense. Plus, when Kahn played against Portugal he wasn't able to stop Portugal from getting a goal, granted they only scored once but still they scored. I think Kahn needs to take in consideration the fact that the team has to score in order to win and they didn't do that against Italy. I think they were trying to get to penalty kicks and Italy was playing for the win and that's what hurt them. IMO, that's not entirely Lehmann's fault. Yes, Lehmann made mistakes but who doesn't? Everyone on the team made mistakes but that's only natural.
The thing with Klinsmann was the fact that he was not going to bossed around or told who should play. He said that the position was open and he went with who he thought was the best. Maybe he was biased? Maybe not. Either way, it was his team and he ran it the way he felt it should be run. He was not afraid to do things his way and he stood up for what he wanted. In the end, I think more folks ended up respecting Germany because they were seeing something new and exciting. The players played with joy on their faces for once and folks took noticed. Germany was the most exicting team in the WC. Too bad they didn't get an award for that.
Now, don't think I hate Kahn because I don't. I just think he can't get over the fact that Klinsmann didn't pick him. He needs to let it go because one should not say they would've won with him because one does not know. Plus, one should never asked "what might've been if so and so played?" because we'll never know. The one thing I'm disappointed in with Kahn is the fact that there were times he would not celebrate with his teammates after they scored or when one came off the field. |
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Sat Dec 30, 2006 12:34 am |
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SNAKE
Yeah, now I'm talking!
Joined: 27 Dec 2006
Posts: 269
Location: Malta
votes: 5
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| tracylynn wrote: | | They might've functioned better with Kahn but I don't think it would've made a big difference because Germany seemed weak when it came to their defense. |
They WOULD have functioned better, Yes, I'm positive about that and also who's job is to organise the defense? I'd say the Goalkeeper, which obviously Lehmann didnt absolutley had no idea, My guess is that Metzelder was leading the back line and Lehmann was shitting in his shorts, like against both Argentina and Sweden.
| Quote: | | Plus, when Kahn played against Portugal he wasn't able to stop Portugal from getting a goal, granted they only scored once but still they scored. |
Well I can answer this, Kahn made about 9 to 12 saves (Mainly from Ronaldo and Pauleta) in 1 match and conceded just 1 goal (Easy tap in goal from 5 cms fom the goal-line by Nuno Gomes) , Kahn was the best player on the pitch in that game, next to Basti Schweinsteiger off course and How many saves did Lamemann made during the WHOLE World Cup?? My guess is about 6 to 9 (Including the penalties against Argentina)
| Quote: | | The thing with Klinsmann was the fact that he was not going to bossed around or told who should play. He said that the position was open and he went with who he thought was the best. Maybe he was biased? Maybe not. |
You bet he was baised, No question about that, both Klinsmann and Kopke were supporting Lehmann from the very begining, Who with the right mentality would have called morons like Huth to the team and not calling up Worns, Kuranyi or even Hinkel. |
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Sat Dec 30, 2006 12:52 am |
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MUTU
Site Admin
Joined: 15 Aug 2006
Posts: 2098
Location: Malta
votes: 8
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Let me start by saying that I was very biased against Lehmann (because of my passion for Bayern Munich and the conflict between Kahn and Lehmann) at the start of the World Cup. During the World Cup he was excellent. None of the goals he let in were his fault, and I doubt Kahn would have saved any of them. He was also excellent in the shootout against Argentina. What more could we have asked from him?
If Kahn had played in the World Cup, Argentina might be the world champions right now...
Last edited by MUTU on Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:35 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Sat Dec 30, 2006 1:21 am |
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yoanna
Yeah, now I'm talking!
Joined: 23 Dec 2006
Posts: 107
votes: 2
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what if sky was green... 
apart from being a brilliant keeper, kahn's way more charismatic than lehmann, but there's really no telling what would have happened or not. 
there are 10 more players running back and forth on the pitch for a reason... it's not like they doing stunts, or sth. the whole team wins or loses (for that matter), irrelevant of who's the keeper. i love kahn to bits, but lehmann did his best, and gotta give credit when it's due. |
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Sat Dec 30, 2006 7:50 pm |
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SNAKE
Yeah, now I'm talking!
Joined: 27 Dec 2006
Posts: 269
Location: Malta
votes: 5
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| MUTU wrote: | Let me start by saying that I was very biased against Lehmann (because of my passion for Bayern Munich and the conflict between Kahn and Lehmann) at the start of the World Cup. During the World Cup he was excellent. None of the goals he let in were his fault, and I doubt Kahn would have saved any of them. He was also excellent in the shootout against Argentina. What more could we have asked from him?
If Kahn had played in the World Cup, Argentina might be the world champions right now... |
Let me say just this, If Germany had another Defense line instead of Metzelder and Lahm, Germany would have been out since Sweden.
I didnt say that Lehmann didnt perform ok, against Argentina he saved Germany, but I am comparing the Keepers. which is the better keeper and who should have REALLY been the Number 1?? For the better of the team I'd Say either Kahn or Hildebrand with Weidenfeller or Wiese as 3rd choice.
But the fact remains that Lehmann was chosen not because of his goalkeeping ability thats for sure.
SNAKE |
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Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:28 pm |
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MUTU
Site Admin
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| As much as I love Kahn and believe he was once the best keeper ever, I believe that Lehmann is currently better than him, and I do believe that at the start of the World Cup, Lehmann was a better keeper and in better form. Lehmann has improved and is playing at his very best, whereas Kahn has gone downhill. Clearly, he is not the same keeper of 5 years ago. |
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Wed Jan 03, 2007 9:46 pm |
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tracylynn
I post all the time
Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 1365
Location: Springfield, USA
votes: 10
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| SNAKE wrote: | | You bet he was baised, No question about that, both Klinsmann and Kopke were supporting Lehmann from the very begining, Who with the right mentality would have called morons like Huth to the team and not calling up Worns, Kuranyi or even Hinkel. |
How are you so sure he was biased? What proof do you have other than having a like for the English teams? I do remember Klinsmann saying that Bayern backed him into a corner about naming a goalie and that, in itself, could have made him lean to Lehmann,
Huth is a moron? Do you know him personally to make that kind of statement? I don't know Huth personally and I think he's an okay player, but I just can't imagine him being a moron nor can I imagine any player being a moron. Klinsmann had his reasons why he picked who he picked and only he can truly tell us why he picked the players he did. We can only guess as to what those reasons where.
I'm not a big fan of Lehmann but I do like and respect him. He did what he could and he didn't do too bad of a job. I don't dislike players who play for the NT but don't play for Bayern, especially if they play in England, because that would be silly. These players represent Germany first and that's what is important and every player did a fantastic job. |
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Thu Jan 04, 2007 12:56 am |
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SNAKE
Yeah, now I'm talking!
Joined: 27 Dec 2006
Posts: 269
Location: Malta
votes: 5
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[quote="tracylynn"] | SNAKE wrote: | | You bet he was baised, No question about that, both Klinsmann and Kopke were supporting Lehmann from the very begining, Who with the right mentality would have called morons like Huth to the team and not calling up Worns, Kuranyi or even Hinkel. |
| Quote: | | How are you so sure he was biased? What proof do you have other than having a like for the English teams? |
Again, Yes Klinsmann was baised that he wanted german players that were part of an english team: Lehmann (Arsenal) , Huth (was Chelsea now Middlesborough), he wanted Volz (Fulham), Hitzlsperger (was Aston Villa), Ballack (Chelsea) (he is an exception  ) and he also once wanted a player named Bullard who played for Wigan he has german grandparents or something, This shows that Klinsmann preffered english baised germans And not calling up real players like Hinkel, Gomez, Kuranyi and Worns.
| Quote: | | I do remember Klinsmann saying that Bayern backed him into a corner about naming a goalie and that, in itself, could have made him lean to Lehmann, |
Any proof of this? There was also the rumor that the best ever german goalkeeper Sepp Maier resigned or was fired because he was preffering Kahn and hired a real close friend of Lehmann - Kopke and all Bayern (Rumenigge and Hoeness) said to Klinsmann was that he should choose now before May to select the number 1 keeper, so that Kahn wouldnt have to suffer a lot of pressure about it, which what exactly happend, But Lehmann was assured from the begining that he will have his place no matter of Kahn's best performance. Like Hoeness said after the "Number 1" choice, "It was no surprise to Lehmann".
Yes the worst defender who ever pulled on the German shirt or anyone's shirt for that matter.
| Quote: | | Do you know him personally to make that kind of statement? |
I dont need to know him personally, i just view his performace both national and with his club, and basicly all he has is brute force and aggressive attitude.
| Quote: | | I don't know Huth personally and I think he's an okay player, but I just can't imagine him being a moron nor can I imagine any player being a moron. |
An Ok player???? Sorry i dont mean to be rude but you should wear glasses, I really dont even consider him a player, he is just like Heskey and Gattuso, a damn savage who is only good enough to hurt other players.
| Quote: | | Klinsmann had his reasons why he picked who he picked and only he can truly tell us why he picked the players he did. We can only guess as to what those reasons where. |
Sure he did every coach has his reasons, but his "reasons" were unjistified and full of errors, in fact that leaving Loew doin the german player searching is undoubtly wrong and unprofessional. Besides in my personal opinion Voller(in 2002) was the better coach at both selecting players and managing.
| Quote: | | I'm not a big fan of Lehmann but I do like and respect him. |
Sure respect the "person" who attacked his goalkeeper rival by stating that he is "better" than him and he shouldnt be the number 1 of Germany because of his love affair AND STILL Kahn gives his backing during the World Cup (namely against Argentina), shows that Kahn was the better person and with his presence in the 3rd place playoff showed that Kahn was the better keeper aswell.
| Quote: | | He did what he could and he didn't do too bad of a job. I don't dislike players who play for the NT but don't play for Bayern, especially if they play in England, because that would be silly. |
He could have done a lot better, thats for sure atleast against both Costa Rica and Sweden, I only liked Lehmann in the penalties against Argentina.I dont dislike all the National team players, I respect even Asamoah who dislikes everything that has to do with Bayern Silly? Silly for you maybe, everyone knows that the quality of German football is far superior to the english no matter if the Premier league has a higher reputation, If in Germany, the clubs has the TV rights and the amount of money as they have in England, Spain and Italy than the Bundesliga would have the atleast the number 2 in the world. AFTER La Liga.
Dont get me wrong, I dont dislike players who play outside Germany, like when Bierhoff was in Italy i supported him all the way(Yes even with Milan), even when Matthaus,Klinsmann and Brehme were with Inter in the 90s, but I preffer selecting from their own nation 1st, then select a possible player who plays outside.
| Quote: | | These players represent Germany first and that's what is important and every player did a fantastic job. |
The young players like Lahm, Schweinsteiger, Odonkor, Borowski(who I was extremly impressed by him), Podolski, Klose, Jansen, Mertesacker, Metzelder and Nowotny(him being 1 of the oldest players in the squad) done a great job, especially beating the living hell out 1 of the tournament favourites, Cristiano Ronaldo's Portugal. But in 2002 Germany did better
Beating and surviving everyone who comes against them, Trashing Saudi Arabia, almost beating Ireland, classicly beaten against Cameroon, beating Paraguay till the end, surviving both Usa and the hosts Korea, it was just bad luck in the final(the mistake and the missed chances) but Brazil were a classier side.
SNAKE |
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